CO2 for feeder euthenasia

CuriousSnake · 08-07-19, 12:08 AM

So I've been looking more into feeder euthanasia, how humane it is, and if there could be better ways to do this other than CO2 that are, similarly, less hands on.

The main problem I've read about with CO2 is that CO2 actually causes pain and suffering as the excess amount of CO2 is what causes feelings of suffocation, not the loss of oxygen. There have been studies done as far back as in the 2000s but more commonly started in 2005. All of which say its probably painful no matter how you do it (with CO2) , but that the only better way is the hands on version of killing the animal (neck and tail trick).

Many people do not have the heart for that and opt for CO2, but if that is still painful then what else can we do? I'm sure more research can and will be done on this topic but does anyone have any current ideas or suggestions on the most effective, least hands on, and least painful way to euthanize?

I have one idea, but I'm not entirely sure if it would work as Ive not done any research on it (yet). As most studies have shown its not the loss of oxygen that hurts but the inability to exhale CO2. This bring me to the idea that *maybe* if there was a way to remove oxygen without adding anything then the death would be more peaceful? instead of pumping in painful CO2 simply removing all oxygen slowly.

I am hoping for a friendly open-minded discussion about this, please don't be super stubborn and unwilling to learn as this is new ideas. Also feel free to correct why my idea may be or is proven to be wrong as well! Look into CO2 and why it can cause pain if you haven't heard of this before. it is interesting and mostly applies to humans as well.

Benjamin1975 · 08-08-19, 01:33 PM

what is the purpose of feeder euthanasia.why not take what ever it is you need to kill to the vet,they have humane drugs that will work

Veronica · 08-08-19, 02:43 PM

The problem with that is using drugs to euthanize means you can't use them as feeders any longer because we don't know how the drugs used will affect the animal being fed.

Gorgon · 08-08-19, 03:18 PM

And CuriousSnake is just talking about feeders so you wouldn't want to have to make a trip to the vet every time you needed to kill -- or at least render unconscious -- a feeder.

MDT · 08-08-19, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benjamin1975

what is the purpose of feeder euthanasia.why not take what ever it is you need to kill to the vet,they have humane drugs that will work

Cost of feeder animal
Schedule time for vet appointment
Cost of vet office visit
Cost of pharmaceuticals to euthanize feeder animal
Cost of techs/office staff

Repeat every time you feed your animal(s)

Rodent Pro lookin' pretty good...

Benjamin1975 · 08-09-19, 05:38 AM

I was confused,I thought he wanted to euthanize a pet who was old or sick.just out of curiosity dont snakes like live food,also cant you get frozen rodents too.I dont own pets so I dont really know

scobro · 08-09-19, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benjamin1975

dont snakes like live food

Sometimes live food likes snakes as well.

CuriousSnake · 08-09-19, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benjamin1975

I was confused,I thought he wanted to euthanize a pet who was old or sick.just out of curiosity dont snakes like live food,also cant you get frozen rodents too.I dont own pets so I dont really know

Live food can be dangerous and you can get them frozen. Before they are frozen tho they are euthanized so its more humane. Either way, the topic is about how humane the CO2 is, not other feeder options.

craigafrechette · 08-09-19, 11:08 AM

I'm not 100% sure I'm reading the original question right.

It sounds to me that you're proposing simply cutting off their oxygen and letting them suffocate?

I'm not too sure how painful the CO2 is, but I'm guessing if it was up to me I'd want it to be as quick as possible.

Suffocating the animal doesn't seem any more humane than freezing them to me.

But again, I'm not sure if I'm reading your question right.

CuriousSnake · 08-09-19, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigafrechette

I'm not 100% sure I'm reading the original question right.

It sounds to me that you're proposing simply cutting off their oxygen and letting them suffocate?

I'm not too sure how painful the CO2 is, but I'm guessing if it was up to me I'd want it to be as quick as possible.

Suffocating the animal doesn't seem any more humane than freezing them to me.

But again, I'm not sure if I'm reading your question right.

The general question is just if anyone knows of or can think of anything better than CO2 since it still causes pain.

craigafrechette · 08-09-19, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuriousSnake

The general question is just if anyone knows of or can think of anything better than CO2 since it still causes pain.

Ok, that's more or less what I thought. To my knowledge, CO2 is the most humane way, but I admittedly don't know a lot on the tooic.

I'll be interested to see what others say. Good thread toipc!

Scubadiver59 · 08-09-19, 02:53 PM

I read several articles on euthanizing w/CO2 and the various mixing methods and concentrations and how they cause distress in the animals before they expire--some combinations make the animal aware they're dying, and others leave the prey clueless until it's too late.

But if someone is worrying about humane methods of euthanizing prey, and not purchasing their prey from someone who does it for a living, or if someone can't abide feeding live prey that obviously suffer painfully (mentally and physically) during the constriction/suffocation process, I wouldn't recommend keeping snakes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigafrechette

Ok, that's more or less what I thought. To my knowledge, CO2 is the most humane way, but I admittedly don't know a lot on the tooic.

I'll be interested to see what others say. Good thread toipc!

PanUzasny · 08-09-19, 02:53 PM

I don't know if anyone has used carbon monoxide (CO). Maybe if you could get the concentration high enough and then introduced the rodents there might not be any symptoms (headache, nausea. Of course, it's probably less safe than the CO2 method, since CO actually replaces oxygen in your blood cells.

Also, I found this article that talked about using an anaesthetic gas first and then killing the rodents. Apparently, they found in a study that some rats seemed to prefer the anaesthetic gas to CO2 (more would leave a compartment flooded with CO2 than with the other gas).

https://www.nature.com/news/rodent-e...rutiny-1.12083

Benjamin1975 · 08-10-19, 05:11 AM

[QUOTE=Scubadiver59;

But if someone is worrying about humane methods of euthanizing prey, and not purchasing their prey from someone who does it for a living, or if someone can't abide feeding live prey that obviously suffer painfully (mentally and physically) during the constriction/suffocation process, I wouldn't recommend keeping snakes.[/QUOTE]I agree with this,pain in the euthanization process in likely inevitable. whether done yourself or done by someone you bought from.so if you like to keep snakes you will have to deal with it somehow