hot snakes

[KD35WIN.AS.ONE]

Originally Posted by americanrebel79

i dont like big crowds of people makes my blood presser go to hi.

If your blood pressure is a concern maybe your in the wrong hobby...

Maybe i stand alone here when i say that i believe the "private ownership" of venomous snakes (for personal/non professional gain) should be outlawed in a country such as ours. (United States) The potential risk of ownership is to great, not just among the primary owner but housemates and neighbors. You must look at the situation in "overall society" terms... People will never understand a so called legitimate reason to privately own venomous snakes for ones own gain... But at the same time can you really expect them to? Private ownership of venomous snakes will never be looked at by general society as simply "passion" but instead recklessness.. And again can you really blame society? A natural disaster on its own is bad enough, but a natural disaster within a neighborhood you.. or your family resides in which in turn releases venomous snakes into population can result in tragic consequences...

I choose to have co-ownership of multiple extremely toxic venomous snakes, in what i consider to be a highly professional environment... But at the same time i find it impossible to justify my actions for doing so.. In the end i find this to be a extremely deep matter to discuss.

[Will0W783]

Wow, that really surprised me KD35....you want venomous snake keeping to be outlawed?? It is indeed a risk, but it's a risk to the keeper and his/her animals, not the general public. Exotic venomous species are not going to be able to survive in the US if they escaped, except maybe in Florida and the surrounding areas. I'm all for regulation and required training, but I feel it is just as much my right to own venomous as any other species of reptile. How can you keep them yourself and say you support outlawing ownership- not to be rude, but isn't that kind of hypocritical? Sorry, this is a subject I feel strongly about, what with the government passing more and more laws to take my animals away from me.

[KD35WIN.AS.ONE]

Originally Posted by Will0W783

Wow, that really surprised me KD35....you want venomous snake keeping to be outlawed?? It is indeed a risk, but it's a risk to the keeper and his/her animals, not the general public. Exotic venomous species are not going to be able to survive in the US if they escaped, except maybe in Florida and the surrounding areas. I'm all for regulation and required training, but I feel it is just as much my right to own venomous as any other species of reptile. How can you keep them yourself and say you support outlawing ownership- not to be rude, but isn't that kind of hypocritical? Sorry, this is a subject I feel strongly about, what with the government passing more and more laws to take my animals away from me.

First off i want to thank you for being kind in your reply, because i truly believe you wanted to say more, but held back. Secondly i would like to add that, as with most states that have or are in the process of passing "dangerous wildlife acts". Current owners and there animals would be grandfathered in the clause, with government mandated housing regulations and a small fee per animal once a year. So to be technical i do not support anyone taking your animals from you. This act would put a strangle hold on the ease of acquisition of venomous snakes through-out the country. Reducing the demand for wild caught individuals to be imported, would in turn reduce the amount of animals being pulled from there native habitat to be crated, shipped and 9 times out of 10 fall terminally ill due to dehydration or a number of things.

While an act such as this may seem opposing in every way, you must try to see the positive aspects. There's much more to it then the stereotypical "because our government said so" outlook. It would truly be most beneficial to the animals we have grown to love. I understand the most exotic venomous snakes fall out of temperate zones that we have here in the united states, my original comment regarding the release of venomous snakes due to disaster/or other unforeseen means im referring more to the immediate danger of a 6' spitting cobra loose in a residential area thats already in a state of turmoil.

I do agree with your assumption that my views on the subject are hypocritical. It really does appear that way, but i just like you i am not comfortable with anyone taking "my" animals away. At the same time if i was regulated and not aloud to acquire any more i would be content with the collection i maintain, and the offspring they may or may not produce. I hope this enlightens you to my personal views on the matter, and forgive me if i offended you in any way. I am glad you choose to reply and give your input on this matter Kimberly.

[StudentoReptile]

KD35, I do understand where you're coming from, and I've had similar thoughts myself from time to time...

But it seems that by your reasoning, we might as well outlaw other dangerous activities as well, such as riding motorcycles, sky-diving, bungee jumping, car-racing, cigarettes, etc. It is up to the individual to educate themselves properly before engaging in such activities and not up to our govt to decide what is good for us.

[Will0W783]

KD35, I do think that in many states, it's way too easy to acquire venomous snakes and giant constrictors, however I don't think they should be outlawed completely. I do understand your viewpoint, but I think a better alternative would be to impose a required training procedure, along with required permits and facilities. At a recent show in my area, reporters walked in and bought a baby monocled cobra, then went out into the parking lot and did a spiel on how they just walked in and bought it and no one asked questions and it was legal..oh no! It's really bad publicity for our hobby.

That shouldn't be. You should be required to have a thorough understanding of the species as well as handling techniques, safety procedures, bite treatment protocols, etc. before you get into deadly reptiles. I also wouldn't be opposed to some regulation of the proper caging and housing one must keep the snakes in. It's way too easy in PA for someone to get in over their head; however, I do adore the hots that I keep and would be devastated if I were no longer able to obtain new ones, or replace mine after they passed away. I am a particular fan of arboreal pit vipers...there's just nothing quite like these beautiful, colorful, bits of amazing evolution. Everything about them, from the keeled scales, the arrow shaped heads, massive fangs, heat sensing pits, amazingly adapted metabolisms, ...it all just blows my mind and amazes me. I feel honored and am very grateful to have these creatures in my life, and I think that other like-minded, properly-trained and experienced individuals should be able to have them as well.

It's a catch-22....how do you ensure the highest level of safety, while not infringing on people's freedom and rights? It's hard to find an ideal middle ground, and no matter what ....regulation or no regulation....someone will be upset, but I do firmly believe that a compromise can be reached that will allow the truly dedicated keepers the privilege of their animals while at the same time preventing "hooligans" and "thrill-seekers" from getting themselves, their friends, and/or their animals killed.

Just my $0.02, for what it's worth.

[youngster]

At this point the OP probably just is gonna go to another forum and find out

If the OP is still lurking around, prove me wrong.

[StudentoReptile]

Yeah, the key is getting responsible hot keepers who are universally-recognized in the hobby working together with officials and locale/state-level law enforcement to find a reasonable regulation system that will both deter the "hooligans" while still not infringing too badly on the rights of the responsible folks.

You are correct, it is a deep topic to get into!

[Will0W783]

Unfortunately youngster, if he is really determined to find a supplier for venomous snakes, he will. They aren't as common in Texas as they are in my area, but they are around. I just hope that he stops to consider getting some actual training before he gets more snakes. Rattlesnakes are nervous, jumpy, strikey creatures....and they are NOT for beginners or the faint of heart.

[Lankyrob]

The system in the UK does seem to work in terms of having to get a permit to keep hots, you need training from a mentor, to pass three exams (one of which is "handling" of a number of hots), your house/hots room is then inspected to ensure ecerything is safe, you have to register with local authority and emergency services as well as local hospital. And twice a year you get a random visit where the premises is checked to ensure you are still doing everything you should be - the permit can be terminated at any point and you are required to give up your animals immediately.

[exwizard]

I find this whole thing to be facinating and informative to watch our two heavy hitters of hots keeping interract and debate the finer details of hots keeping. I'll never keep hots myself but I'm getting an education here.

[millertime89]

How is this humane?


Or this?!


PETA and HSUS ignore this because they don't care. Tell your friend to get a clue. Rattlesnake is good to eat, but I will never again eat it unless I know its origins. I'm "ok" with ranching, I'm NOT ok with the mass roundup of wild animals for slaughter for sport. There's a reason there is a tag and permit system for most game animals. But our gov't continues to ignore what goes on in Texas, Oklahoma, and other states.