Snakes ARE affectionate - Page 3

sophiedufort · 04-23-15, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

None of my snakes care a single bit for me from what I can tell, they're just as quick to go running off as they are to climb on me.

My snakes actually seek me. Not all of them, though. The Brazilian rainbow boas are very independent. They are very content when I hold them, but they will rarely come to me. But the pythons and the other two boas are different. Missy, my Dumeril's boa, will spend hours around my husband's neck, and she pokes him with her nose if he stops rubbing her back. Dante, our het ghost Colombian red tail boa, is behaving like a spoiled brat when we put him back in the enclosure. He becomes crazily anxious and desperately tries to climb back up. He actively seeks my husband's touch, opting to stretch at his side and fall asleep there, even though there are many other enticing hiding spots around. As a matter of fact, we always leave a backpack nearby, as the snakes love it, but more often than not they will come to us instead of hiding in or under the backpack. Every now and then, one of them will choose the backpack, but it's rare. We also have two ball pythons, a normal and an albino. Zoey, the standard ball python, has been around the longest. She is crazy jealous of the other snakes, and attempts to intimidate them when they try to come close to 'mommy' or 'daddy'. Mojo, the albino, is still very shy, but getting closer to us every day.
All our snakes have different personalities. My husband and I spend a lot of time with them, rub them and even kiss them. All of them, without exception, enjoy the kissing on the side of their head. If I stop kissing them, they turn their head and look inquisitively, then move to my lips, pressing against them. This is so funny.
Call it what you want: being docile, submissive, calm and trusting, I call it affection.

**Minkness** · 04-23-15, 09:43 AM

DDW- Lizards, turtles, snakes, and any other form of reptile or amphibian I am leaving out, all share that lack of the warm fuzzies. This does not mean that you cannot earn the trust and respect of said animal however. It's just not 'love' in the basic sense of the word.

Example....you have a coworker who you HAAAATE for whatever reason, but, let's say that they are a good worker. Do you trust they will be there? Do you respect that their work ethic? On the other side...let's say it's a friend that you genuinely love...but you have coke to expect them to be unreliable and a bit of a ditz. Can you trust they will be there for you? Do you respect their judgements? Love, trust, and respect do not always go hand in hand.

Now, I have 3 different snakes with crazy different personalities. One of which is my western hognose who will actually come out of his hide and 'greet' me when I enter the room, and will show that 'separation anxiety' if I put him back in his enclosure. I feel he is just curious and may want more time out and about, but has little to do with 'me'...even if it makes me smile every time it happens lol.
As a side comment...please don't release any snake into the wild as an experiment if it will come back or not...I'm sure ssssnakes was being cheeky...so please do not take that suggestion seriously. Just...don't....

DDW · 04-23-15, 10:58 AM

Minkness and FWK: I understand, I just had to think it through(rather than impulse posting) there is a difference between "love" and just merely recognizing or relying on someone/something. Trust is a part of love but love is not a part of trustXD.

MDT · 04-23-15, 11:22 AM

Sophie....google Limbic System. Reptiles don't have one. Emotions happen here.

I really do like my snakes....they in turn, have no regard for me.
I love my family.....they in turn (at least they say), love me back.

I'm totally cool w this.

**lady_bug87** · 04-23-15, 11:33 AM

They are currently exploring the reptile brain and are finding that it's less primative than they thought. However under no circumstances does that equal affection.

They aren't social animals. There is no need for them to be. Arguably having most of the captive reptiles in private collection being CBB its understandable that through the generations they become more tolerant to people. That's just genetics. That's domestication. Not love.

RAD House · 04-23-15, 12:18 PM

Words like love and affection are words made up by humans to describe chemical processes in our brains. These processes on the other hand are very real in all cases. Cynical maybe but true nonetheless. To say snakes don't feel love to me seems untrue as they also experience these same chemical processes to a certain degree. On a purely human point of existence I think that we can all agree snakes can learn to trust their owners. From my experience trust is a huge part of love. Secondly I also think snakes do realize that certain people are there to care for them over other people. This is not entirely different than the love a young child has for a parent. I mean this in the sense that the child is a completely selfish being that depends on the parent for care. Saying snakes do not love is just as anthropomorphizing as saying the do as the word is entirely a human construct.

eminart · 04-23-15, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MesoCorney

Saying snakes do not love is just as anthropomorphizing as saying the do as the word is entirely a human construct.

No, it isn't, because we DID construct the word, and it exists to describe a set of emotions and actions that snakes do not possess.

**lady_bug87** · 04-23-15, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eminart

No, it isn't, because we DID construct the word, and it exists to describe a set of emotions and actions that snakes do not possess.

This is exactly it.

MDT · 04-23-15, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MesoCorney

I think that we can all agree snakes can learn to trust their owners.

Um, no we can't....because acclimation isn't trust. And, some just don't acclimate at all.

**lady_bug87** · 04-23-15, 12:33 PM

Are you comparing your snakes to my children?

**EL Ziggy** · 04-23-15, 01:38 PM

I love my snakes but I don't believe they love me back and that's ok. I'm just the source of their food, water, shelter and warmth. Because I provide these things we have established a bond of tolerance and trust. I love their beauty and mystique and try to give them the best possible care but I know if it were up to them they would have nothing to do with me and I'm ok with that too

.

eminart · 04-23-15, 01:41 PM

And to the original poster, it's great that you love snakes. If the worst thing about you is that you think they love you back, I think you're OK.

Personally, I'm fine with the fact that the majority of my pets would eat me if I were small enough. I still love keeping them.

RAD House · 04-23-15, 02:44 PM

I don't think there is any question that was exactly what I was doing lady bug.

Eminart words like emotions and love can not be applied directly to snakes in any way because they are made to describe the way we interpret our own brain chemistry. A snake can experience the same brain chemistry as us but can it interpret that as love or not love? The answer is no and so saying a snake feels or doesn't feel love is giving it human characteristics as only we understand what love is. What we can do is study the chemistry that occurs in the brain and what that means to humans. To be fair given the right conditions any pet would eat you, maybe even your own children.

MDT by definition acclimation is getting used to a new environment and trust is expecting the same results. Acclimation does not apply to what I was talking about.

MDT · 04-23-15, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MesoCorney

MDT by definition acclimation is getting used to a new environment and trust is expecting the same results. Acclimation does not apply to what I was talking about.

Ok...I'll restate. Your snake neither knows you or trusts you. Mine do not "know" me or "trust" me.

My retics could give a rat's behind who or what i am....when I open the enclosure, it's game time. Unless I break that response by tapping with a snake stick, paper towel roll, etc, if I put my hand in the enclosure, I will get bitten. Every. Single. Time.

Once I break that response, I can manipulate them out of the cage, but I will not let my guard down. I know what they are capable of.

That is their genetically imprinted behavior. That is what a retic "is". That is what I love about these amazingly beautiful animals. But there is no reciprocity on their part.

sophiedufort · 04-23-15, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDT

My retics could give a rat's behind who or what i am....when I open the enclosure, it's game time. Unless I break that response by tapping with a snake stick, paper towel roll, etc, if I put my hand in the enclosure, I will get bitten. Every. Single. Time.

I had ten snakes so far, not counting two that I found in the garden and kept for a couple of days before releasing them. I have never, ever been bitten. Not once. I reach inside my snakes' enclosures a hundred times a day, and they are never hostile. Then again, I hold them for hours on end, and pet them just as much, and so does my husband. The only snake that sometimes seems to be on the edge is my smallest Brazilian rainbow boa. She is ready to strike when I reach into the feeding tub to pick her up after she ate, but as soon as she can smell me she ceases her display of aggression and lets me grab her.