Ahaetulla or Boiga?

[boosh96]

Which would make a better introduction to venomous snakes-mangrove snakes of the genus Boiga, or vine snakes of the genus Ahaetulla? Which is easier to care for, and what species out of these two genera makes the best pet? Thanks in advance!

[Gungirl]

Getting a mentor would make it easier...

You might want to read this over.. it's great. http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/general-venomous-forum/88485-hot-school-what-you-need-know.html

[youngster]

^^^^ Kat's right, any hot is a big undertaking. As Shauny would say, not trying to be cheeky or anything.

[stephanbakir]

Keep in mind... I've owned a few vine snakes and they generally ONLY take birds or lizards or fish or frogs... depends on the species.

[Kayla90]

Watch out for the mangroves, their venom is still pretty necrotic, and they have zero fear of biting.

[boosh96]

Which vine snake is the kind that eats only fish? Can they be fed goldfish, or do they need other fish in their diet? Because I was thinking-a diet of fish would be much easier to provide than a diet of anoles.

[KORBIN5895]

Here is a site for feeder anoles. Feeder Lizards (http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog/feeder-crickets-worms-rodents-roaches-and-more/feeder-lizards/)

[stephanbakir]

I belieev goldfish contain thiamine, the fish eater is pretty rare, can;t remember the name. Green vines are the easiest to get but they only really eat lizards.
Mangroves are easy to get but they have a habit of being psychotic

[Will0W783]

boosh96, the best first hot isn't. I know that sounds stupid, but really the only way in is to work your way up slowly, do extensive research, and find a mentor.

There are various ways to go about getting experience with non-hot species, depending on what hots you intend to eventually keep. If your goal is to work with arboreal vipers, an aggressive GTP would allow to get some training....again, it's NOT the same thing, and is NOT an alternative to good mentoring, but it will help you get quicker with hooks and anticipate bites and movements.
If you wish to work with elapids, I'd recommend a red-tail green rat snake, or a tiger rat snake. Both are fast, agile, typically aggressive species, and if you can get good with one of those on a hook, you will have a much easier time getting used to working with elapids. HOwever, it's not going to prepare you anywhere near as well as a mentor would.

I have been keeping snakes for years, and only recently made the transition to hots, after years of working my way up through rat snakes, mangroves, etc. , and getting some time with a mentor.

As long as you've had sufficient experience with non-venomous species, I'd go with the mangrove over the vine snake. Vine snakes are very hard to keep successfully in captivity from what I've read. They usually will only eat frogs and lizards and are very susceptible to parasite overload. Most are wild-caught and are carrying parasites that may be hard to eradicate in them due to their very delicate nature. You can find captive bred mangrove snakes, although they are rarer than imports, but looking for a CBB mangrove is definitely worth the wait. Mangroves will eat rodents, and are generally hardier and easier to hook and tail.

[boosh96]

Does anyone know where I can find a venomous mentor? Because my dream isn't really to keep hots, but at the very least to work with hots and start keeping "warm" snakes, such as vine snakes, mangroves, or FWC's, and then maybe keep "beginner" hots, like Pygmy rattlers or copperheads.

[alessia55]

boosh96, the best first hot isn't. I know that sounds stupid, but really the only way in is to work your way up slowly, do extensive research, and find a mentor.

There are various ways to go about getting experience with non-hot species, depending on what hots you intend to eventually keep. If your goal is to work with arboreal vipers, an aggressive GTP would allow to get some training....again, it's NOT the same thing, and is NOT an alternative to good mentoring, but it will help you get quicker with hooks and anticipate bites and movements.
If you wish to work with elapids, I'd recommend a red-tail green rat snake, or a tiger rat snake. Both are fast, agile, typically aggressive species, and if you can get good with one of those on a hook, you will have a much easier time getting used to working with elapids.

Kim is giving you good advice here.

Get experience with hooking and working with difficult non-venomous snakes first. A mentor is more likely to take you on if you already have plenty of experience in that regard, and are comfortable with hooking, etc. Do tons of research into the sorts of hots you'll want to work with. A mentor might be more comfortable working with someone who has done all his research, rather than someone who is learning everything for the first time from him. With regards to actually finding a mentor... Find a local herp society or club in your area, meet people, and ask around to find out who owns hots. Attending a reptile show that has venomous reptiles might also help put you in touch with local hot keepers. Choose your mentor carefully- ask lots of questions!

[millertime89]

there's really no "beginner" hot's. A hot is a hot is a hot. As far a mentor, find keepers local to you that can point you in the right direction. Also don't be discouraged if the first person you ask to mentor you says no, have a pupil is a HUGE risk and undertaking.

[stephanbakir]

A pygmy rattler and a copperhead will still do a ton of damage.

[boosh96]

I know someone is going to answer that all hots are the same and stuff, but really, which hot makes the BEST first hot? I'm considering a copperhead or maybe a pigmy rattler, or an eyelash viper for my first hot. Whichever is the safest works for me, but I want to make my decision so I can figure out which "trainer" snake to get.

[millertime89]

rear fanged, something like a hog nose or false water cobra.

[boosh96]

Alright-can I keep a water snake (Nerodia spp.) as a "trainer" for a while before getting a FWC? What kind of snake makes a good "trainer" for a mangrove snake?

[Gungirl]

The best "trainer" you can get is to get a mentor. Keeping a defensive or aggressive snake that is "like" a hot does not make you ready for a hot.

[boosh96]

Is there any chance you could help me find a mentor?

[Gungirl]

No one that I am aware of would mentor a 15 yr old.. never mind a 20 yr old. I would say that your best bet would be to do a TON of research and once you are 18 start looking into getting a mentor. Being a mentor is a huge responsibility for that person. I am not looking to upset you but at your age I would hold off on anything besides research.

[alessia55]

You're 14, right? A mentor taking you on would have to assume responsibility for you as a minor. Your parent(s) would probably have to agree to allow you to train with the mentor, and would be present at all training. It's a huge risk for a mentor to train someone who's underage because of all the liability issues simply due to your age. It sucks, but being underage does put limits on what you can and can't do for a while. Once you're 18 and responsible for yourself and are allowed to enter into legal bindings, a mentor might be more willing to take you on. Until then, do all the research you can, and get non-venomous snakes to practice with. If I were a mentor and I agreed to take on a minor, I would probably even include contracts that remove me from being responsible for you, and insist that parents be present at all times. On that note, what do your parents think about you wanting to take on hots at such a young age?

[boosh96]

I'm 15, and my dad is okay with the idea of me keeping a "warm" snake, such as a hognose or a mangrove or something like that. My dream isn't necessarily to keep hots, but at least to work with them. Could you help me at least try to find a mentor?

[millertime89]

where are you located? best bet is to find a local herp organization and ask them.

[stephanbakir]

As I said... Mangroves are still pretty necrotic... careful.