View Full Version : WDB feeding issues.
First off I would like to say hi to everyone here.
now on to my question.
I acquired a WDB about 4 months ago. He is about 24" long I have been feeding him 3 hoppers per week. He was eating like a champ. Anyway... Last night I went to the pet shop to buy some hoppers but they were out. They were out of fuzzies too, so I opted for 2 small adults when I opened his enclosure he was more pissy than usual. I proceeded to tong a mouse and offer it to him. He struck it it died a while later but he wouldn't eat it. He usually takes them from the tongs and eats them like that. I took it out and cut the neck open s the smell of blood might entice him, but no. I figured maybe he was not in the mood for tong feeding, so I just dropped the other in turned out most of the light and watched silently. he approached it and struck it. He continued to follow it striking it for about a minute till it was dead. I left him alone for 4 hours went back. He did not eat them. should I be worried? He is not opaque, His last poop looked a bit more watery than usual. but I examined it and found no squirmies in it. I have lowered the room temp to 72f but it ha been like that for 2 weeks now.
Should I be worried?
percey39
11-16-10, 05:14 PM
Was your snake wild caught?
How come you feed live?
Why have the temps dropped?
How are you heating him?
What size viv is he in?
I would up food size if your feeding 3 prey items at a time.
No he was CB as far as feeding live The guy I got him fed all live and it dont really seem to entice him with a F/T teasing.
He was pretty thin when I got him
The temps have dropped because I was gonna hibernate him but at the same time trying to fatten him up while he acclimates a bit.
I use a heatpad, a hide that I made the top is a heatrock,(it is fine and it wont burn him) a heatlamp, and now in the winter a stationary heater.
his vivarium is 50"x24"x24"
I try to not feed him anything that is bigger around than he is. Its easier on his digestion system.
infernalis
11-16-10, 11:53 PM
You seem knowledgeable enough, were you aware that lowering temps with food in the snakes belly is a very bad idea?
All snakes depend on heat to properly digest food, when a snake brumates, they stop eating first so the stomach is empty.. otherwise the food will rot inside them.
BlindOne
11-17-10, 12:06 AM
I wouldn't bother him for a week, then attempt to feed him again. No need to brumate him, IMO, he's not breeding size. I'd keep him warm all winter and fatten him up.
Good luck with him, WDB are fun snakes. I remember one that would start rattling when you started up the stairs and was striking once he could see you :yes: Talk about attitude! Most of my rattlers have been sweethearts though.
You seem knowledgeable enough, were you aware that lowering temps with food in the snakes belly is a very bad idea?
All snakes depend on heat to properly digest food, when a snake brumates, they stop eating first so the stomach is empty.. otherwise the food will rot inside them.
Yea I do know that about the digestive system, but I figured if the ambient temp was 72f he still has the basking spot and the heatrock, and he still pooped.
Anyway I did get him to eat I decided to turn the heat up in the morning, threw a hopper in there in the evening, and he ate it. He must have been going into brumation, and having a giant hovering him when he was trying to turn in for the season was probly stressful. I may consider brumating him in a month or so. He is not fat enough. I have never hibernated an animal before so as that goes I am a noob.
I just started to panic and started to think parasites. The only knowledgeable person out here I know is Bob Myers, of the Rattlesnake Museum. I don't really trust what a vet would say concerning my animal. we don't have any herp vets that are recommended here in NM.
I appreciate your input guys.
BTW... Does anybody know how to brumate a snake? Should I put a deep substrate with a narrow and deep hide?
I wouldn't bother him for a week, then attempt to feed him again. No need to brumate him, IMO, he's not breeding size. I'd keep him warm all winter and fatten him up.
Good luck with him, WDB are fun snakes. I remember one that would start rattling when you started up the stairs and was striking once he could see you :yes: Talk about attitude! Most of my rattlers have been sweethearts though.
Sorry for the double post.
Fluffy is a good guy for the most part. I took him out last night after he ate so I could change out his strate, clean his water dish and his hides. He actually tried to chase me down. He is so small and so sure of himself. His disposition does change from day to day.
Thanks for the advise I don't think I will brumate him this year.
shaunyboy
11-17-10, 12:07 PM
You seem knowledgeable enough, were you aware that lowering temps with food in the snakes belly is a very bad idea?
All snakes depend on heat to properly digest food, when a snake brumates, they stop eating first so the stomach is empty.. otherwise the food will rot inside them.
hello and welcome
i know nothing about hots.
percy39 is the man for them
my diamond python has night time lows of 50f during her cooling cycle
i always wait 1 month to clear her gut before i start to drop the temps
being too cold and having food in their bellys can cause regurgatation
your guy maybe wont take his food because he knows the temps are dropping and is also readying himself for his cooling cycle
this is how i do it with the diamond but she's a carpet python.
a truely unique snake though as they are known as true cold weather pythons
no other carpet get kept this way only diamonds
cheers shaun
hello and welcome
i know nothing about hots.
percy39 is the man for them
my diamond python has night time lows of 50f during her cooling cycle
i always wait 1 month to clear her gut before i start to drop the temps
being too cold and having food in their bellys can cause regurgatation
your guy maybe wont take his food because he knows the temps are dropping and is also readying himself for his cooling cycle
this is how i do it with the diamond but she's a carpet python.
a truely unique snake though as they are known as true cold weather pythons
no other carpet get kept this way only diamonds
cheers shaun
Thanks!
As far as hots go the only real difference is that of course they are venomous. Once you get over that hump you realize they are normal snakes. You just can't play with them(though it is tempting). That being said, keeping hots in your collection is not for everyone. It does require super secure caging and handling equipment, + trying to find a vet that will even let you in their door is a whole other problem. Luckily if I do have an issue I can ask the owner of the rattlesnake museum.
BTW:
That is really interesting about diamonds I didn't know about it. I honestly assumed they were the same as a ball and would have cared for it along those lines should one have plopped into my lap.
percey39
11-17-10, 07:21 PM
I dont bother brumating any snake at all if im not planning to breed as the whole process is rather risky, especially if you have not done it before. If he ate straight away once you bumped your temps up i think its pretty clear that they were to low for him to feed. I would not bother brumating him at all. Also as long as you know someone who is a expert with this species you can ask questions if something goes wrong thats great.
Dont get me started on vet's most people over look this when they get into this part of the hobby. I found one who is great but is 3 hours away and the only one i know of in my state that will see them.
Thanks for the info percey. The only reason I was gonna brumate was because it is part of a natural life cycle, and I figured it might prolong his life.
So now that the feeding and brumating is covered I have another question...
I use full spectrum lighting for all of my snakes. Should I be be dusting his food with reptile vitamins? I Don't really see a "need" for it as long as all of my animals are healthy.
infernalis
11-18-10, 09:00 AM
UV is not needed for snakes.. That's a lizard thing.
It never hurts to sprinkle some reptile vitamins on the prey, it's not really required, but it doesn't hurt either.
Reeeaaaaly?. I never would have known. I like the light output better than fluorescent or incandescent. It looks more like real sun light. but I do admit I bought it for health reasons. It is good to know that it is not necessary.
Here is a pic of fluffy eating.
percey39
11-18-10, 05:24 PM
Yeah as Wayne has said there is no need for UV for snakes. Brumating is only needed to breed, if you dont want to breed dont brumate. Snakes will live long healthy lives without if.
I have never bothered with any reptile supplements, as they will get what they need from their food. This is why they require full prey item's instead of steak lol they get their nutrients from parts of the prey item.
Nice looking little guy!!
Thanks!
I know I am dragging this post on but What do you guys think of changing up their diets?
I do feed him chicks one or twice a month to offer other vitamins he would not get off of mice
PS: I know the picture quality was bad I pulled it off of my video.
percey39
11-18-10, 05:36 PM
I vary my hot's diet with chicks and quail as well. The snakes love the chicks, but the poo does smell a bit more lol. I believe it sort of keeps them guessing as to whats for dinner.
percey39
11-18-10, 05:48 PM
Im from Australia and we have a huge range of feeder breeders with a even bigger variety of food. I have fed my pythons anything from chicks, quail, rabbit, rats, mice, ducks and a few others as well. I feed some of my larger hot's rabbit pinks as well.
I can get all but the quail, Time for an internet order
infernalis
11-18-10, 07:02 PM
Frozen Mice, Frozen Rats, Rabbits, Guinea Pigs, Chicks and Quail (http://www.rodentpro.com/)
They sell quail chicks.
Frozen Mice, Frozen Rats, Rabbits, Guinea Pigs, Chicks and Quail (http://www.rodentpro.com/)
They sell quail chicks.
Sweet Thanks!
Here is another pic of fluffy
infernalis
11-18-10, 08:29 PM
Looks like a real character.
My wife said no hots, no retics or burms... so I am stuck looking at pics of everyone else's.
infernalis
11-18-10, 08:33 PM
Thanks!
I know I am dragging this post on.
Drag away... There is no limits.
Chuck has a thread that is crazy long "head shots" been running for months.
BlindOne
11-18-10, 09:07 PM
Looks like a real character.
My wife said no hots, no retics or burms... so I am stuck looking at pics of everyone else's.
I got out of hots once I had my kids, not worth the risk. Otherwise, my wife would be fine with them (she's a biologist)
percey39
11-18-10, 09:30 PM
I got out of hots once I had my kids, not worth the risk. Otherwise, my wife would be fine with them (she's a biologist)
This is why i dont plan to have kids LOL i want to continue to keep these guy's!
infernalis
11-18-10, 09:39 PM
This is why i dont plan to have kids LOL i want to continue to keep these guy's!
I never planned on any of mine, but you know how it goes...
Now that they are here, I would never trade them for the world, Even if they do drive me crazy.
percey39
11-18-10, 09:47 PM
Haha i enjoy the practice mate!!! I have friends who are exactly the same and call me crazy to say i would rather keep my collection of "killer snakes" over having children. Just think they can both kill but ones slower, they both send you broke, they both eat you out of house and home, they both sleep a lot BUT one does not talk back or ask to bring home the boyfriend/girlfriend. Also you dont mind your snakes mating unlike your young teenagers!
BlindOne
11-18-10, 09:55 PM
Haha i enjoy the practice mate!!! I have friends who are exactly the same and call me crazy to say i would rather keep my collection of "killer snakes" over having children. Just think they can both kill but ones slower, they both send you broke, they both eat you out of house and home, they both sleep a lot BUT one does not talk back or ask to bring home the boyfriend/girlfriend. Also you dont mind your snakes mating unlike your young teenagers!
As much as I loved my hots, they are nothing compared to my kids. Plenty of other snakes out there that only bite :)
infernalis
11-18-10, 09:55 PM
Also you dont mind your snakes mating unlike your young teenagers!
True, and youtube will allow mating videos of snakes.
Reptile_Reptile
11-18-10, 09:55 PM
lol nice one
percey39
11-18-10, 10:10 PM
Haha i completely understand blindone, but im in love and have been for a couple of years now haha. The BOSS has put the hard word on me more than once, i always reply what about my babies!
lhQ6igVrYo0
I know my videos suck I will start making better ones
marvelfreak
11-19-10, 12:31 PM
Nice video. Sweet looking snake and cool set up. IF i was you i get a new snake hook. Me and my buddy both got one of the collapsible ones like your his broke the first time he use it. Snake fell back into the cage then shot out and tag his hand because it was pissed. So now we both got solid one piece hooks order. Last thing you want is to have something like that happen to you.
Indeed I had to get a better one. Also the setup is the one that he came with I am also buying a different setup from herpcages.com
presspirate
11-19-10, 03:43 PM
I know my videos suck I will start making better ones
Don't beat yourself up. I liked the video very informative, I had always wondered how people do water changes and stuff with venomous. Very nice looking snake as well! He'd intimidate the crap outta me though.
Don't beat yourself up. I liked the video very informative, I had always wondered how people do water changes and stuff with venomous. Very nice looking snake as well! He'd intimidate the crap outta me though.
They are intimidating, but you cant let it make you panic. they do respond to your body language. So if you are fast and jerky you can expect them to be the same. A couple of days ago I had to change his substrate so I did as I showed in the vid. After it was changed I decided to let him out onto the table to try and take some pics. As soon as I opened the lid and hook him he springs off of the hook and proceeded after me. My only choice is to not give him too much ground and work with the tongs and hook and just calmly get him back into his enclosure. It was kind of scary but I have the knowledge to do what must be done, and not become complacent. I have never been bitten by a venomous snake. Unless you count a western hognose.( no ill effect it was the front teeth). I understand that most "hot" keepers do eventually get tagged, and one day my number may be up. But it is part of the hobby.
Anyway thanks for watching!
BTW: I had him waay(like 3 months) before I uploaded the video.
Reptile_Reptile
11-19-10, 05:49 PM
what do you mean he isnt a venomoid?
infernalis
11-19-10, 05:57 PM
what do you mean he isnt a venomoid?
A venomoid is a snake that has been surgically altered (Had it's venom glands removed) to no longer produce Venom.
highly frowned upon by anyone who is into snakes for real.
It's usually done for "he man wannabes" so they can free handle a rattle snake, viper or cobra just to impress others.
I compare it to surgically implanting a horn on a horse because you want a unicorn.
it sucks!
Reptile_Reptile
11-19-10, 06:04 PM
ahh i didnt know the term but i am familiar with the surgery and yea its like lifting paper weights that say 50lbs on them
what do you mean he isnt a venomoid?
No He is 100% all there. I don't believe in hacking a snake up for my pleasure.
If I get bitten I will have to go to a hospital. I don't have antivenin at my house & the nearest hospital is 50 miles away. Like I said I do understand what can happen to me if I get hit by him, it is something that I knew was possible before I rescued him too.
Here he is in striking position
After release
and with his mouth open
ao4jwyIiXiA
Ha! I figured it out
Sorry I haven't been here in a while but I thought I would give an update. He has been on f/t for a while now. eating 1 adult weekly I am to weigh and measure him tonight if he sheds today. He has been opaque for 3 days so I have just been misting him once a day to keep him moist, I want to get a good shed to save.
Hope you all had good holidays.
Reptile_Reptile
01-07-11, 03:08 PM
good job on the F/T switch. pics from post shed would be appreciated
marvelfreak
01-07-11, 05:05 PM
Nice video! One suggestion you might want to get snake tongs it make it easier and safer to for handling him.
BlindOne
01-08-11, 09:52 AM
Nice video! One suggestion you might want to get snake tongs it make it easier and safer to for handling him.
I think it's too easy to injure a snake using tongs. I always used hooks myself
I do prefer hooks to tongs. But thanks. he still hasn't shed. He is back to looking dull and his eyes are clear so he should shed here in the next couple of days. I took him out weighed and measured he is 6.88oz and 27.5" long not including the rattle. Man I tell you tubing him was an adventure in its self.
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