View Full Version : Mites and monitors..
Simple question .. can monitors get mites??
I am asking this cause I hm dealing with mite with my snakes right now and wondering if the monitors are succeptible .. I have never seen it b4 but would like to know if it should be a concern..
tx
Dom
I have never seen mites on any monitors their skin is way to rough.
To be safe, just get a vapona strip, cut off small cracker sized pieces and throw it into a margerine container with some small wholes in it. then just toss it in for 12 hours on and off.
Snake mites are host specific. Your lizards and other herps will be unaffected by them. If you happen to get lizard mites into your collection then its a different story, but lizards cannot get snake mites. Hope this helped :)
Yes it did - thansk so much guys!
I went to buy NIX tonight .. Well see how effective it is! lol (for my snakes that is.
Jeff_Favelle
12-28-02, 07:38 PM
Please don't put Vapona near any of your reptiles Dom.
Jeff, that was a very ignorant response. Why not use vapona? In small amounts its fine, and works very well. You dont keep it up for long periods of time. It's alot safer than nyx. Next time you decide to disagree, instead of being arrogant explain why.
Linds: lizard do get snake mites. They are the same thing. Trust me, i know from expieriance.
Vapona is safe when you use it on large reptiles. Using it on baby reptiles in large quantities is toxic of course, but you dont put an entire strip in. All the sceptism with vapona is unnessecary providing its used properly. I along with many other people I know use it when need be. Which is rare, as it should be.
Jeff_Favelle
12-29-02, 12:18 AM
Ok.
Vapona works by vapours (yikes), NIX is basically just a soap that works mechanically and chemically. The answer wasn't arrogant and it wasn't even aimed at you. I was talking to Dom (hence the usage of his name) and he replied quite nicely to me that he wasn't going to use Vapona. I'm sorry if you have stock in the company or something, but I wouldn't advise ANYONE to use it.
The active ingredient (for organic chemists) is 2,2-dichlorovinyl dimethyl phosphate. That's nasty stuff man. Its a freakin' carcinogen!!! Its also a stomach poison, and its only meant for professional use. I have no idea how Vapona gets away with selling the stuff, but I wouldn't be caught dead (pun intended) with the stuff in my house, near me, my animals, or my family. DDVP is NOT something to fool around with. In fact, I'd rather play on a highway than breathe the stuff in. Call that arrogant. I call it smart.
In small amounts, cancer is fine. Does that mean I want little bits of cancer? No. What is a small amount to you or I of Vapona, could be a lethal dosage to a reptile 1/200th of your size. What about long-term affects? What if it affects fecundity? As a breeder, that would definitely suck for me. NIX is approved for use on HUMAN HEADS! Its a soap that smothers the insects while working as a mild chemical agent. Probably not the greatest thing, but far, far safer than DDVP. Plus its local. Anything that is used as a local agent is 10x more effective and safer than a general agent.
Go here for some analysis: Thanks for your time...
http://pmep.cce.cornell.edu/profiles/insect-mite/ddt-famphur/dichlorvos/insect-prof-dichlorvos.html
http://www.prop65news.com/pubs/p65news/issues/9207/920714.html
http://infoventures.com/e-hlth/pestcide/dichlorv.html
Thanks for listening.
Dom, sorry to butcher your thread, but at least there's learning going on right (inside joke), ha ha! :D
Happy Holidays. :D
No i dont have stock in the company
and yes it was arrogant. you should have said why not use vapona, for my and anyone elses information. After your post, i have changed my mind on vapona, and Your post was very knowledgable. Thanks for the input.
Jeff_Favelle
12-29-02, 12:30 PM
No I should not have said why not to use Vapona. I have 70+ adult snakes coming out of cycling and I don't have time to write care-sheets and hot-to's for people who need every word spelled out for them. I told DOM not to use Vapona, we talked by PM and agreed. That's it. You're the only one that seemed to have a problem with it. So I had to take 20 minutes out of my day to explain it to you, and now you agree. Woopee. What does that do for me? Nothing. Where's my 20 minutes? Gone. Another 5 are gone now. Sweet deal.
And that's why helping people is like a kick in the f**king teeth. I told Dom not to use Vapona. He PM'd me and we discussed why. He concurred. Then you posted that I was ignorant!! In my dictionary (in my head) "ignorance" is when you talk about stuff that you have no clue about. Now, how is that possible with my subsequent post? Perhaps someone is ignorant, but its certainly not me.
Let me run it down for you (one more time for the learning impaired):
1) I said a statement and then backed it up with facts.
2) You called me ignorant, and then agreed with my facts!!!
Please help me understand this grand contradiction in statements. I must be getting dumb. Old age is setting in. I guess I had a good run.
:D
lol Jeff and V.aw - i gotta tell you - these are really interesting post!
You guys should argue more often lol
Tahnsk for all the info guys
Dom
Originally posted by V.aw
Linds: lizard do get snake mites. They are the same thing. Trust me, i know from expieriance.
Snake mites (Ophionyssus natricis) are small, black specks while Lizard mites (Hirstiella tronbidiiformis) are slightly larger, red/orange guys. Now I have never seen any lizard mites on a snake nor any snake mites on a lizard (and I have experience treating both species of mites in mixed collections), though they can be transmitted to birds. I had always thought (because of their names, and my past experiences with both of them) that they were basically host-specific..........
Linds, iam so impressed that you looked up the latin names for mites. That will help a newcomer out so much!! Anyways, Yes they're are more than one type of mite. HOWEVER if it goes to a snake, it will goto a lizard. Bird mites are a completely different story, Those do not bother reptiles, nor do reptile mites bother birds. Yes, i do agree. Mites are host specific, as fleas stay to mammals mites stay to reptiles. (snakes/lizards being the host)
Actually, avians and reptiles have alot of similarities (hence why vets that specialize in reptiles are often avian vets as well) and they can be affected by lizard mites (H. tronbidiiformis).........
Iam not going to argue about this anymore. Out of my years of expierience, working in pet stores, owning a huge variety of snakes and reptiles as well as birds, ive never seen your "assumptions" occur. I could be counter acting your arguement with latin names to sound intelligent as well, but i dont need too. From my exp this is what has happened.
Hooo... Dom i wish you good luck with that big one:D
You will have a lot of fun and maybe some scrach:)
Jeff_Favelle
12-30-02, 02:03 PM
Yes, but from my experience, my snakes don't get mites. Can I now deduce that my snakes are immune to mites? I don't think so.
lol I got rid of all of them! lol in two days .. (the big one did not have any mites though lol ..
NIX IS THE BEST PRODUCT IN THE WORLD!
It does not even compare to Ivo .. I would recomend it to everyone!
Dom
Jeff_Favelle
12-30-02, 07:14 PM
Glad it worked Dom (but I knew it would). Another feather in your husbandry cap. Its a good day.
Jeff if that was directed at me that was pretty childish.
My initial post to Dom was not to be too confident with Lind's suggestion that mites are "host specific" as i have found mites of the same color/type on both snakes and lizards in the past.
Example, I brought in a redtail, qaurentined him but unfortunatly my basement isnt very large and the mites got to my frilled dragons. Exactly the same mites as they're were on my boa. Cleaned the same way, (with vapona, although I tend to agree with your views on Vapona now)
I dont see where i implied anything about "mite resistence".
Grow up.
Jeff_Favelle
12-31-02, 12:17 AM
It went completely over your head man. It wasn't childish, it was meant to make you think. If you like I can word it another way, but I'm baffled that you couldn't see the original intent. My English isn't that bad is it?
Here we go:
You said a bunch of stuff and then said "From my exp this is what has happened." Right? Well, the I said "Yes, but from my experience, my snakes don't get mites. Can I now deduce that my snakes are immune to mites? I don't think so."
See the connection? No?
All I was trying to point out was that observations by ONE individual over a SHORT period of time cannot be taken as fact. Nor should they be. If we did that, statistics would be more of a joke than they already are.
I just found it a dangerous assumption on your part to assume stuff as factual, based purely on your observations and experience, as extensive or small as that may be, especially when someone had the EXACT opposite experience.
It wasn't childish, it was an illustraion, and I'm still stumped how you didn't get the connection. From now on, I won't speak metaphorically then.
Now, what's the verdict everyone? Can lizards get snake mites and vice versa. We need to clear this up to move on and progress. I didn't care about it before, but clearly people can benefit from this knowledge.
So someone please find out.
Jeff, I never once said anything was immune to anything. As i said, Mites in MY expieriance attack both lizards and snakes. Ive seen both RED and BLACK mites on each species.( WHICH i feel is an easy way to dismiss any sceptism of wether or not the mites will effect both species in my books) I just let Dom know not to be too sure of Linds's post. I feel Linds was just lucky if she found mites on one thing and not the other, does this mean the mites were host specific? Nope. It means she got them before they hit the other animal. IMHO. If i saw mites on one animal in my collection i would be very cautious of any spread.
I think you should try to read, and try to lose some of the arrogance. But then again, you do know everything and MUST throw your arrogance around trying to look good.
On top of everything, you say i shouldn't be stating facts if they are from "short" observations? What the hell do you think Linds did? And you're picking at my point? Follow the herd man, follow the herd.
Jeff_Favelle
01-13-03, 01:10 AM
I totally must not understand the English language:
Iam not going to argue about this anymore. Out of my years of expierience, working in pet stores etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc ................
As i said, you MUST interfere in most posts with absolutly nothing of knowledge or help, just to argue and be arrogant. I rarely see you even attempt to help people out. Look at this thread, you jump in and argue other peoples opinions instead of actually attempting to help. Then of course continue the arrogance by trying to make others look stupid. I hope it makes you feel good.
Jeff_Favelle
01-13-03, 12:15 PM
So the thread being about Vapona included me having NO knowledge whatsoever, yet I seemed to change the original poster's mind as well as yours on the subject. Wowsers. I must have some special brain powers to do that without any knowledge on the subject.
Be right back. I'm going to go and use my special brain powers to get my snakes to breed and some girls down the street to take their clothes off.
Its going to be a great day! :D
Jeff_Favelle
01-13-03, 12:29 PM
....and some advice:
1) Take a pill.
2) Concentrate on breeding some animals rather than starting, continuing, perpetuating useless arguements.
3) Don't confuse proper English, kick-a$$ grammar, and the ability to write critically with arrogance. They are NOT one in the same.
4) Who the heck am I following? I breed f**king snakes for a living!! You think I'm a follower? Yeah, I guess I'm so mainstream that I'll have a music vid and a cereal based on me soon.
5) Can't remember when I said I know everything, but if so, then I guess its time to kick back and let the ol' brain do all the work from now on.
6) Why not actually try and figure out the query in hand rather than taking random shots and trying to flame anyone who disagrees with you?
I hardly see how me advising people to be careful about a potentially lethal poison (Vapona) is interfering. But yeah, maybe you're right. Maybe helping people is not a good thing to do. Perhaps knowledge is best left to oneself and people can figure things out for themselves.
Thanks for wasting 7 minutes of my morning. And its cloudy out and cold (7 degrees). Definitely not snake breeding weather. This sux. Not to mention my new "no posting" rule is now shot.
So anyways, yeah, calm down. Take it easy. No one's out to get you man. But your defensive nature and random flames just leaves you too juicy of a target not to make fun of. If you just take it down a few pegs, you'll find the forums a lot more fun to use.
:D
actually I Disagree with alot of people as these forums are to exchange information.
As for my "kick A@@ grammar" whatver man.
Yes, i liked your vapona suggestion it was great. If you only posted something educated when it came to the mite arguement other than an arrogant comment like the one you did, i wouldnt have gotten defensive.. After all, this was a post to aid dom, not to argue about it....... As for Linds, she disagreed with me, i disagreed with her.. Iam sure neither of us are lying, or intentionally trying to ruin someones collection, BUT we both gave examples of our observations.. Not just a one liner being a smarta$$.
You never said you knew everything, but you seem to post in response to quite a few things with one liners just being arrogant, or questioning someone elses ideas.
as far as breeding reptiles, how do you know i havent bred anything? Iam not gonna go into a list, and try to compete with you either.. I can't afford to run out and purchase an adult breeding pair of ackies, then proclaim myself some monitor breeding expert.. Congrats on the ackies though. Iam currently working on breeding my Albigs, Ive seen alot of activity, and currently have a trio.. So wish me luck.
Iam done with this arguement, its rediculous.
asphyxia
01-13-03, 10:06 PM
...now what am i going to do???
B
Oh one more thing (sorry) The vapona post. You did the same thing as you did here. (bud in and then say why after the arguement starts)
"Dont use vapona dom" No explanation.
"My snakes dont get mites" No explanation.
The End.
asphyxia
01-13-03, 10:20 PM
.
asphyxia
01-13-03, 10:22 PM
OK...now what am i going to do???
Hey Dom...No more "simple questions"...Lets go for the really hard and drawn out ones eh
Jeff?...
jason h
01-13-03, 11:00 PM
LOL!!! hey dom i m glad to hear your snake mites are gone and glad you didnt get any lizard mites, but i would do them again in three days as the mites arent as hard to get rid of as the eggs my friend so its good to go over them again to get any new hatchers that may have been missed.
tightsqueeze
01-14-03, 09:05 AM
amen to that ....lol
It was a simple question to start with that started a big debate .. except fir the occasional cursing (wich is trully unapreciated and unwanted here) both of you guys make good points .. thanks for all the help and sorry to have cause this whole dilema..
I personally enjoy these conversation .. I find that it is when two or more ppl disagree that the learning truly begins.
Dom
Just admit it, Dom, you enjoy having 2 grown men fight over you :) lol must be the bike
Gotta admit, this thread is very informative.
lol Very good advice JasonH I Had plans on a follow up treatment .. again .. for me, NIX was amazing!
Edwin .. what can i say .. women fight over me all the time .. its nice for men to do as well lol .. (lots of sarcasm implied here) :):):)
It didnt really start off as an arguement.. I just stated my observations and let dom be aware that Lind's observations although accurate to her, were not completely right and to be careful. Some other parties decided to be rude and offensive.
BTW .. Thanks V.aw , I apreciate your input :)
Canada_Club
01-18-03, 01:13 AM
Well I don't know Jeff (but I'll have to look him up if he lives in Victoria!! hint hint), and I don't know V. aw., but I would say that V. aw was the 'arrogant' one and was being "rediculous" ( its ridiculous). You had the nerve to call Jeff F. arrogant and rude (although his post was by far more educational and enlightening), yet you ridiculed Linds for using scientific nomenclature like a 5-year old that doesn't understand syllables. Why is that? Why so cutting and rude right away when someone disagrees?
Why did you insist on yammering on and on about how you didn't like Jeff F.'s reply? I honestly thought you were going to start crying! You keep saying "I'm done with this" blah blah blah, yet continue to post on it. And your posts have nothing to do with the original post by Dom (hey Dom, I always wondered the same thing!!). I mean, way to waste people's time and webspace. This was the first post I read since being here so I was kind of at odds with whether or not I should join. Luckily I checked out a dozen or so other threads and I found out not all posters are like V. aw.
And don't act like such a baby because you can't afford small monitors and someone else can. It makes you look bad.
Have a nice day.
Canada Club. I dont see where i was rude.. I just said that snake mites go back and fourth, and instead of simply saying "not from my experience" Linds said the scientific names for mites... That didnt help much, and i kinda of took that as a knock more than anything (although i guess she meant otherwise, i dont care)
I said jeffs post was arrogant because he just did a one liner response and didnt explain why. I'd rather see an explanation as to why my method is wrong so i can better my husbandry techniques. And in a previous post he was extremely helpful with his views on Vapona, even though he started off with a one liner..
As far as crying about affording monitors.. Iam not even going to list my collection to you, But money isnt really an issue..My point was basically, dont make one liners with no explanation.. Leave that to the pro's who you can trust, like Ravi, Kahane or JonK. I trust all of their opinions immencly, as they actually have raised and worked with alot of animals, not saying that Jeff F hasn't but i have never seen him on this forum until he purchased that trio of ackies, which hes had alot of success with and i applaud him for that, but his techniques dont help me much with my albigs or salvators.
I honestly dont see the harm in a few arguements on these forums. We all love animals, and feel we do the best for them, and explaining our husbandry in detail is a great way to learn. I feel the main problem with these forums are the people who interfere in posts and just show their views on the post in discussion and the way people communicate and argue their opinions, and not the actual point of the post. I actually respect Jeff, and Linds alot as they are very firm with his opinions.
YOU have a nice day.
Adam
And before you just read my post and try and look "cool" by correcting my grammar, i meant to say "Their" opinions instead of his. Thanks.
Yes, mites, sand fleas and ticks do infest African varanids; mites get into pockets in the skin folds around the feet, sockets, and joints; sand fleas around the back and cloaca; ticks around the nares, toes, cloaca. ALL can pass nasty diseases such as trympanosomiasis, Rhodsesian Sleeping sickness and Q-Fever, all of which can be pathogen-borne to Humans too! But to-date, no reports of this has occurred, only that varanids are vector disease for these parasites, and these parasites carry theses maladies that have been transmitted to people across east Africa.
Ticks of course are the most frequently seen/encountered, but mites have been seen to on varanids. Talcom powder works well, as it plugs up the mites air breathing passages and suffocates the little sh$t things to death, same w/ticks. Best is to remove them and submerge = drown in alcohol. But if alot of mites/ticks are involved, perhaps contact a vet and ask him; maybe a fleas color placed into a dixie cup w/air holes in it and this cup which is contact proof to the lizard, will be proximity kill the mites/ticks?
Good Luck,
wow mark that was a very useful post, thanks.. we need more posts like that!
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