[b]anti-venomoid Thread[/b]

[Mustangrde1]

Those interested in helping.

I State and Federal laws and or statues on Animal Cruelty as well as Aphis information. More is always needed E-MAIL them to me.

Also I for some strange reason never get responces back when I e-mail persons who have these animals for sale. I normally ask , Who performed the surgery. Do they have medical records of the surgery. Can i have a copy if before purchasing the animal. What is their method of shipping. Is there any fallow up care I should be concerned with when i receive the animal.

This information I would hope to get from any person I buy an animal from it is not a lot to ask for. If a Petetion or Information broucher is to be started it needs to have the laws a discreption of surgery and the possible hazards to the animals health and handlers. It should also have copies of the information above to back why we would want this to stop.

If anyone has Vets who are familiar with this procedure and are willing to voice an opinion from a Medical stand point it would also be great. Also Law enforcement and Medical Doctors and Biologist would be other great people to help.

Tell friends and post to other forums and try to get people to help be it word of mouth or simply wishing to sign a petetion. Heck reffer them here to add helpful info even. But do not let this thread turn in to a War of Words.

Lastly Making it illegal to be done May or May Not be possible. However, Forcing Authorities to enforce the laws I do believe are. I do believe a Law requiring some sort of Medical documentaion IE Surgery performed by a LICENSED CERTIFIED VET can be created that would require the Sellers to have this documentaion on hand when selling them and must be provided ahead of time to a prospective buyer to verify before purchasing along with the info sent to the buyer after purchase stating by the vet who did it that the snake is { 100% safe and uncapable of inflicting a venomous bite}. Yes it's not a ban but how many vets will violate their ethical oath and or want their name on a possible law suit?


Veterinarian's Oath

Being admitted to the profession of veterinary medicine, I solemnly swear to use my scientific knowledge and skills for the benefit of society through the protection of animal health, the relief of animal suffering, the conservation of livestock resources, the promotion of public health and the advancement of medical knowledge. I will practice my profession conscientiously, with dignity and in keeping with the principles of veterinary medical ethics. I accept as a lifelong obligation the continual improvement of my professional knowledge and competence.


If you want to help Post here as to keep it in one thread and not all over the place. Ive even gotten confused with all the threads on it now.

[Gregg M]

Well Scott,
You know what I am doing...... I am passing some of my emails to you and so far there have been a few laws being broken....... These void dealers are not only breaking animal cruelty laws but others as well....... How funny would it be if the feds got involved?????LOL

[ont_herper]

Just some ideas I have, sorry if someone already posted these things, not sure the best way to work it or whether it's allowed but I was thinking about some sort of email petition. I thought this could be done by writing an email against voids and posting here then getting everyone to copy/paste and send off. Theres also where it should be sent, one would be to the gov't and the other to void dealers, in either case gov't or void dealers maybe provide a different email every week?? That way different gov't officals/ dealers see our anti-void point of view.
Also what about posting a list of who sells voids so people dont buy from them.
I'm not sure if these things are allowed to be done on a forum, if not I believe you could get a free web page/homepage somewhere and provide links to the site.
Based on the number of views on any void posting I think this could be an easy way to get lots of people involved.

[Mustangrde1]

This is still in the works but an online petetion is in the works as is a few other things Including some rewording to include {pit} tags to be required in these venomoids for proper tracking. Ive been at it over a year and many people are helping. But everyones ideas are good. Just can not put them all in it or it will become so jumbled that the heart and soul of the petetion and law might be lost in the jumbled mess.

[snakehunter]

Sign Me Up

[crazykeeper]

Where do I join?

[Mustangrde1]

If you wish to help Make copies of the above post and pass them out at your Herp Society. Let your members see it and comment on it. Anyone can e-mail me their comments and they are welcomed. Keep in mind the Legal process is by no means fast. This may take some time to get through but all good things take time.

If you wish you can put on the bottom of the flyer contact MustangRde1@aol.com I will read them

[Mustangrde1]

This is the post i wanted you to copy and pass out to your respective herp societies,

We as concerned members of the herpetological community find the surgical alteration of venomous snakes to be a practice that can be cruel and inhumane and potentially life threatening to the handler or bystanders. We pray you to not allow or condone the sales of these animals through or in your state or on any {Website, Magazine or Reptile Shows, Private Party Transactions} within your State's jurisdiction without proper proof of the surgery being performed by a Licensed Qualified Veterinary Surgeon registered with the American Veterinary Medical Association.
We ask that any and all of these Altered animal be accompanied by a Notarized sworn affidavit from the Veterinary Surgeon that conducted the operation as well as copies of all medical records. We ask that the Veterinary Surgeon certifies that animal to be harmless and incapable of ever again delivering a venomous bite.

We ask that in order to sell any of these altered animals on or within your State on any {Website, Magazine, Reptile Shows or Private Party Transaction} that the vendor/seller provide proof upon request for verification of the Veterinary Surgeon who performed the alteration as so the buyer may contact the Veterinary office for confirmation. This information should be provided to any employee of your State and to the {Website, Magazine or Reptile Shows, Private Parties} for verification.

We put this to you as it is known that these surgical procedures are performed by unlicensed person and without proper use of narcotics for the relief of pain and suffering along with post surgical infections that this causes great pain and suffering to the animals.

This pain and suffering is animal cruelty and is an unneeded procedure and not warranted for the animals health or well being. This Surgery is performed to render a venomous snake harmless and with cases in point to show that in time the animal if the surgery was not performed completely can again be capable of producing venom and delivering a fatal bite. This can and does pose a risk to the handler and or any bystanders and is a matter of public health and safety.

We further pray you to require the use of Passive Integrated Transponder tags, or "PIT tags," tags to be implanted in the altered animal so as law enforcement agencies can verify the authenticity of these animals. We also ask that these animals biannually have an attempted venom extraction performed by a qualified Veterinary Doctor and the results must be kept by the keeper and the performing Veterinary Doctors for review by Fish and Game officials upon request.

With many State as well as Federal laws pertaining to Surgical standards and Pain and suffering to animals we ask you to not allow any animal without the above mentions documentation and verification of legal surgery performed to be sold through your state or any {Website, Magazine or Reptile Shows Private Party Transactions} within your jurisdiction.

[crazykeeper]

Wow with all those rules and paperwork,it will be too expensive to buy a venomoid.Unless your rich...

[Mustangrde1]

Not at all its simply requiring evidance of proper surgery and the ability to verify the animal/ animals are the correct ones. Along with verification twice a year to their not being a danger to humanity. If you want to play with a void you pay for the knowledge of its harmless state. If it cost you a large sum of money it is your choice no one is twisting your arm to buy it.

[crazykeeper]

No i mean i can see the void industry folding if you have to go through all that work,ie surgury by vet and documentation+the twice a year atempted milking+ the pit tag.After all that the snake would be worth 450-500...To much work and $$$ for a void,,I,ll keep my HOTs no rules and cheaper..