Hamsters, Gerbils etc.

[Auskan]

It seems like most everybody is feeding mice, then rats. Where do hamsters or gerbils fit into this? Can they also be used as food?

[mykee]

They can be used as food, but rats are the more accepted nutritionally complete food for snakes.

[Linds]

Hamsters have a high fat content. Both gerbils and hamsters can be addictive to some species. Both are also far more expensive to purchase as food. Gerbils don't have high production. There may also be availability issues with both hamsters and gerbils. They have a place, most commonly they are fed to problem feeders.

[Bighead]

Positives and negatives of Gerbils:

Plusses: (1) Many snakes eat them in the wild i.e. ball pythons (2) better temperment than mice and rats (3) They do not canniblize unless they run out of water or a pup dies naturally (4) Just as easy to breed (5) Smell WAY less than mice and rats. They drink and pee way less too.

Negatives: (1) Less available, especially in bulk. (2) More expensive (3) Produce smaller litters, 4-7 in a litter and 40-50 in a lifetime. (4) Not as much research done about nutritional info, etc.

Hamsters:
Stink more than any of them, bite more, too fatty, etc. I don't even recommend them for pets.

[mykee]

Bottom line: you hear more about rats because they're all-round the best food item for your snake.

[daver676]

Originally posted by Bighead
Positives and negatives of Gerbils:

Plusses: (1) Many snakes eat them in the wild i.e. ball pythons

One source of food for a ball python in the wild is a gerbil-LIKE mammal called a Gerboa.

(5) Smell WAY less than mice and rats. They drink and pee way less too.

I have had both Gerbils and mice as pets, and the Gerbil was MUCH dirtier, smellier, and all around messier than the mice.

[reverendsterlin]

also some individual animals will start refusing any other prey type. I always recomend against using them for that reason alone but then use them as a technique to get BP and hognoses eating if I feel they have been refusing food to long, it generally works but still not a 'good' thing.

[mice4you]

Originally posted by Bighead
Positives and negatives of Gerbils:


Negatives: (1) Less available, especially in bulk. (2) More expensive (3) Produce smaller litters, 4-7 in a litter and 40-50 in a lifetime. (4) Not as much research done about nutritional info, etc.



The main reason they are hard to come by in bulk is that they are very poor colony breeders. They do best in 1.1 pairs. This along with the slow rate of reproduction makes breeding them a pain. To make matters worse, once snakes are on them, it is hard to get a snake to take a mouse or rat again.

[Linds]

Originally posted by Bighead
(2) better temperment than mice and rats

You must have some special gerbils. Mice are not the most interactive rodent out there, but I definitely wouldn't put a gerbil ahead of a rat in terms of temperament, or in most cases, even mice. Most of the gerbils I've dealt with didn't hesitate to bite, and were relatively nervous animals.

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

Hmmmm, im in alberta so forget the live rats and stuff but i have NEVER been bit by a gerbil but i have been bit by mice(mine and others) alot. I also find that the mice smell more if there are alot of males or they are not entertained(if mine dont have alot to do they just sit around and piss and **** -pardon me there-) they tend to stink alot more than gerbils. I have found that if gerbils are not cleaned enough(not that thats only with them, its with any animal but still) they tend to stink. My findings are that gerbils are in a way cleaner because they do not pee as much and they do not spread their poo all over the cage, they put it in one spot. It seems to spread the aroma less. I am still opposed to feeding gerbils as opposed rats + mice. I think the gerbils are not as nutritious(im sure most would agree) and also have one hell of a bite if they chose to bite a snake(i have never experienced one but the only person i know of getting bit by one it was brutal). I find hamsters are fatty as mentioned before and they dont have the greatest nutritional value to them. Also they have a painful bite(i know this first hand) and can be very agressive. I would definetly go with rats and mice as a feeder and only use the others(gerbils and hamsters) ocassionally or for a tough feeder.

[HERPSKEEPER]

If its got fur, legs, a tail, moves around on its own, and will fit in my snakes mouth its FOOOOOOD. I dont care if its mice, rats, hampsters, ferrets, rabbits, chickens, gerbils, fancy mice, fancy rats, cats, dogs, pigs, goats, chinchilla's, etc.I know my snakes have eaten many on this list and will eat many on this list when it gets bigger.My biggest snake is almost 11ft and 55-65lbs and growing fast.Mmmmmmmmm all that warm blooded animal talk have made me hungry.LOL

[HERPSKEEPER]

If animal huggers get wind of that post,they'll shoot me



LOL bring em on

[djc3674]

If its got fur, legs, a tail, moves around on its own, and will fit in my snakes mouth its FOOOOOOD. I dont care if its mice, rats, hampsters, ferrets, rabbits, chickens, gerbils, fancy mice, fancy rats, cats, dogs, pigs, goats, chinchilla's, etc

I can see feeding your snakes most of the above prey items, except for cats and dogs. They are domesticated animals with a certain degree of intelligence that cannot be compared to any species of rodent. Therefore, they should not be used as prey items.
I am hoping that you were j/k. I certainly wouldnt respect you as a reptile keeper, much less a human being, if you fed a cat or dog to your snakes.

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

Agreed.

[Linds]

Originally posted by djc3674
, except for cats and dogs. They are domesticated animals with a certain degree of intelligence that cannot be compared to any species of rodent. Therefore, they should not be used as prey items.


Playing devil's advocate for a moment... Pigs are also a domesticated animal, and have a much higher intelligence than both of the above mentioned. That being said, they are also accepted as prey items for large snake... :flick:

[djc3674]

Pigs are also a domesticated animal, and have a much higher intelligence than both of the above mentioned. That being said, they are also accepted as prey items for large snake...

I tend to disagree, my pug is pretty damn intelligent. I cant see how a stinky farm animal can be smarter than a dog. hehe Although, I have heard that pot belly pigs are pretty smart. Also, they are not to kept as a domesticated animal nearly as much as cats and dogs.

Seriously though, how can someone justify feeding a dog to a snake? A pig is different, especially the farm raised ones. They are raised and harvested for our consumption. I LOVE BACON!!! lol
So feeding a pig to a snake seems to be much more acceptable.

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

Yes, in a sense i agree. However, pigs are very inteligent creatures and they just dont seem to know how to use their inteligence. Pigs arent kept as much and people do not work with them and try to figure them out so they dont learn as well. In another sence, dogs and cats have been raise to be close to humans and they are almost like a brother(or sister) to humans. We take them in like family. How many people do that with a pig?

[Gezt]

Ferrets are pretty smart too. If fed alive im thinking they could kill a snake. Ive seen a ferret beat up an average sized dog. (a wuss dog but a dog none the less).

Not to mention there about 300 dollars.. Talk about an expensive meal.

[Gezt]

"Yes, in a sense i agree. However, pigs are very inteligent creatures and they just dont seem to know how to use their inteligence."

Haven't you read animAl farm? lol

[brandi]

Ferrets??? Ferrets are in the weasel family... you know, same as a mongoose? They're built for killing snakes and lizards!

[Oliverian]

Hey guys, you wouldn't even have to worry about bites if you weren't feeding live. I would think a live ferret in a snake cage is an accident waiting to happen. :(

-TammyR

[Linds]

Originally posted by CHRISANDBOIDS14
However, pigs are very inteligent creatures and they just dont seem to know how to use their inteligence.

How do you figure they don't know how to use their intelligence? They obviously must or they woudln't have beat out other animals in tests and trials.

Originally posted by djc3674
I tend to disagree, my pug is pretty damn intelligent. I cant see how a stinky farm animal can be smarter than a dog.

There have been many *scientific* studies on this. Both dolphins and pigs outrank dogs and cats in terms of intelligence. Pigs are becoming incresingly popular as pets, and can be trained to do much more than dogs and cats. Do you even have any experience working with pigs, or are you just basing this opinion on the fact that you deem them to be stinky farm critters? Dogs and cats will always (in N. America anyways) be defended as food simply because they have never been seen as more than companions, not because of their level of intelligence, and of course the warm and fuzzy aspect has something to do with it ;)

Originally posted by djc3674

Seriously though, how can someone justify feeding a dog to a snake? A pig is different, especially the farm raised ones. They are raised and harvested for our consumption.

It's just our culture and the mentaility and traditions we have been raised with. Go to some other places where they would find it disgusting that we eat cattle. Some places in the world acts and dogs are raised for food much like we raise pigs and cattle.

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

Well what i meant is we dont watch pigs use their inteligence, its not known as much, i guess, we dont know how to use their inteligence. Maybe thats it? Im not too sure what i mean, i know pigs are not stupid and smarter than dogs(definetly smarter than my dog, lol, but hes funny), i just, well, it doesnt SEEM like pigs are as smart even though they are, i know someone with a pet pig, and it is quite inteligent.

[C.m.pyrrhus]

An animal is an animal in my eye. I feed rats premarily because of the ease of breeding, price and over-all the nutritional value. Personally, I am not a huge dog and cat lover, and see no problem using them as means of food, either for human or pet consumption. I would never use them for this reason myself, but in light of it all they are just another animal. To say that they are 'better' than pigs, horses, mice or birds is a personal observation to each person. In N. America and other cultures, they are concidered to be a 'higher' lifeform. But, when it gets down to the nitty-gritty...they are just animals like any other. Be it a pet to you or just another lifeform that exists, that is all they are.

[Oliverian]

Pyrrhus, very good post. I agree. Most people just don't think of them as food, as they've been brought up to think they're pets. If we were all brought up raising chickens as pets, I bet we'd be pretty grossed out at the thought of eating them too.
-TammyR