Oddball viper and pitviper venoms

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Hi all

Just a quick post to see who has oddball viper and pitvipers that I might be able to get a milking off of? This is for a comparative study of the evolution of viper vs. pit-viper venoms and how things have changed since the pit-vipers split.

I'll be in Europe next year (Italy, then Hamm, Germany then over to the UK and then up to Scandanavia) so can do milking/pick up milkings then. In the US, we can sort it out quite easily if you are in Florida or the SE. Other parts of the US are doable in getting the venom freeze dried at least.

I don't want anyone to attempt to milk any snakes unless they have had experience before (in other words, its your butt on the line and you have to accept full responsibility if you give it a go). However, we can probably make arrangements for a compentent person to milk it.

I am after anything odd you might have around, the rarer the better. This includes Causus, Atheris, Bitis (I'd like to get as many different species as possible, including both east and west gaboons, rhinos, standard puff adder, cape puff adder and of course any dwarf Bitis), Bothriechis, Bothrops (and related genera), Cerastes, Crotalus (durrissuss of course as well as some of the oddballs like tigris), Daboia (both palaestinae and different populations of russellii), any Echis, Eristicophis, Macrovipera, Pseudocerastes and different Vipera.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers
B

[Mustangrde1]

Dr Fry

Need any Crotalus or Sistrurus?

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Definately. What do you have or have access to?

Take care mate
B

[Mustangrde1]

Eastern and Western Diamond backs , Eastern Coral, Dusky pigmy rattlers. and chocolate chip cookies.

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Dusky pigmys would be a nice addition. Where are you based? Are you able to milk yourself or perhaps someone like Ray could help out?

Thanks heaps ;-)
B

[Mustangrde1]

I probably can convince Ray to juice them im only 20 minutes from him. I have about 20 in my collection to choose from. I can get more if you want a broad spectrum to choose from for a species profile.

[Gregg M]

I have all the gaboon and puff adder venom you will ever need.....LOL...... I also have gaboon X rhinos if you want to study their venom........ It is a natural intergrade in parts of Africa.....

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Hi mate,

the Bitis would be interesting as would the integrade (most definately). What state are you in and we can arrange freeze drying.

Thanks heaps ;-)
B

[SCReptiles]

We are in Ringgold, GA…about 10 minutes south of Chattanooga, TN. We have Agkistrodon c. laticinctus, Crotalus h. atricaudatus, Sistrurus m. miliarius, Micrurus fulvius, Agkistrodon p. piscivorus, Crotalus adamanteus, Agkistrodon contortrix mokasen, Agkistrodon c. contortrix, and Crotalus horridus horridus. You are welcome to any samples you need. These are some of the same DNA samples that Dr Schuett will be using in his up coming book.

[BWSmith]

PWD, you've got mail :D

[BWSmith]

Oh, and you may want to contact Mardi. He just had Cottonheads born I believe ;) That should be some odd venom.

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Hi mate

Thats exactly what I'm after. I want odd snakes. Either rare, some weird island form, something that has dropped someone in an unusual way (ie a milking from a C. horridus that caused a neurotoxic bite but with minimal or no swelling. That would be perfect) or a hybrid of some sort or another. Naturally occuring would be nice but captive mixes would still be fascinating in how the venom recombines. Potentially very informative. I'm not encouraging anyone to breed hybrids specifically for this but hey if you've got them, I'd love milkings from them. Simple as that ;-)

Cheers
B

[BWSmith]

(ie a milking from a C. horridus that caused a neurotoxic bite but with minimal or no swelling. That would be perfect)
OK, got the clutchmate of one that matches that description perfectly. Unfortunately, the original biter died. Also have an adamanteus that caused a neurotoxic bite as well, there was some edema.

[Gregg M]

Hey Bryan,
I sent you am Email from the "other" forum.....LOL...... Just let me know what you want to do....... I will help any way I can......

[BWSmith]

Oh, and lest we forget, PK has a baby. A p piscovorus. He was born after 3 years confirmed in isolation, no telling how long before that. He is 2 years old and has grown maybe an inch. Still has all his newborn pattern and color including the yellow tail. Gentically deficient snake. My poor Pre-K :D

[ETET]

Dr. B,

Is deinagkistrodon, atropoides, probably some daboia (haven't arrive yet) good for you?

Just one question, I used to do some milking for some daboia russelli for a laboratory, the snakes seems to stress out, fast and stop eating for quite a while ;and a couple of them died after a few milking sessions. The method we used - the daboia bite through a plastic film attached to a container without any assistance like electric stimulation, negative pressure...; the snakes injected the venom by themselves. The population were around 20 and 15 snakes (adult with average size aroung 4.5 feet) were milked every 3-4 weeks for a period of 4 months. But that's around 10-15 yrs ago. Is there any new or less stressful method in collection of venom?

ETET :)

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Hi mate

Those species would be perfect. Where are you located? As for the milking stress, for some species there is no avoiding that. However, we don't need much venom at all so none of the snakes would need to be milked more than once.

Thanks again ;-)
B

[reverendsterlin]

your welcome to milk my crots and bitis

[Dr. Bryan Fry]

Hi mate

What species do you have and where are you located?

Cheers
B

[reverendsterlin]

New Mexico, Las Cruces exactly, plus Roy at the rescue probably has some mojave(most likely western range locale), lepidus, WDB, and a couple of months ago said he was getting a gaboon pair. My crots are mother/daughter, gaboons no clue except west africans, have a cantil and local western hognose as well. Might even have a prof with a WDB that would help.

[atheris]

Hmm, i have 11 Vipera spp. plus some Atheris spp. Macrovipera spp. etc.. and maybe i can get you some small amount of each species.. But only if you can give me some results of study what you will do with venom ?! Because im doing a research of caucasus viperas in captivity and in situ. Information about structure of venom between some populations is needed.

And i have all localitet data for my snakes.

You can send me e-mail if interested my offer.

Kert Lipponen

WWW.HOTSNAKES.ORG