Warning against feeding frogs and grass hoppers…

[Steeve B]

After a few unexpected death from baby monitors, I did a study on frogs and grass hoppers, as I was sure they killed my babies by poisoning.

First let me say both these foods are excellent for monitors, don’t hesitate to use them in fear of parasite or any other unfunded idea, if you don’t use them it’s your monitors lost.

As far as aim concerned my only apprehension to not feeding them to my varanids, is because of there rarity (frogs) they are in fact becoming scarce, and I refuse to participate in there depletion, but when plentiful I feed them generously to my monitors without any problem what so ever, this for 25 years now! So pleas forget about the parasite crap!

However there is a problem with these foods, read this carefully as a WORNING,
Frogs and grass hoppers in late fall becomes toxic! DEADLY TOXIC even fox and racoons don’t feed on them in late fall, when the fist appearance of knight frost there blood start to produce high levels of glucose to protect them from freezing, much like antifreeze in cars (that’s exactly how car Preston was invented) I completely stop feeding them from then on.

Even if parasite and disease don’t worry me the least, PESTICID scars the heck out of me, Grass Hoppers can travel a kilometres easy, Think about this when you collect, Farmers usually use pesticide in late spring and sometime early summer if many weeds in there crops, they may also use fertiliser, its not safe to collect before at least 3 weeks after these products have been used.
In spring and summer many ponds and water course are treated for mosquitoes, needles to say frogs and crey fish may not be safe at this time.

Also if your into fishing! Call fish and wildlife to know the lead content in fish where you collect them, it vary depending on time of the year, they have to know to protect the population from lead poisoning.

I find the safest wild food to be earth worms, preferably from your back yard if you don’t use chemicals, but still it’s easy to ask when or if a treatment was don.
Breeding is the best option we have.
Hope this helps!
Rgds
Ps. I who’d appreciate any farther information on this! As I did a very brief study to satisfy my inquiries, pleas feel free to correct me if needed.

[John A]

i remember this conversation last year. at first i thought it was pesticides, or pickerel frogs mistaken for leopard frogs. there are grasshoppers in fields in jersey but i havent netted any in years. same for feeder frogs. i opt to feed earthworms dug from my yard or woods, or shore crabs at the beach (i.e., jetty dwelling crabs). cheers -john

[Kyle Barker]

Thanks for the info, no need to reply to my e-mail :)

What are your thoughts on freezing frogs so you have a supply in winter. Or would they produce that anti-freeze like substance in that period of time (of freezing, roughly 1-2 hours)? I cant beleive there is a good use for all these bull frogs :):):)

[Scales Zoo]

Thanks for this information.

I was unaware that grasshoppers produced an antifreeze that was toxic to reptiles. I was talking to an experienced breeder the other day who suggested I try and collect a bunch and freeze them to send off to him. I wonder if freezing would trigger this at all.

I would think when it cools in fall, they would start to produce this.

I live in a grasshopper farm called Saskatchewan. We litterally have tonnes of grasshoppers, I could catch them by the pound. I am finding out about pesticide and other crop spraying in the area - but catching grasshoppers still makes me nervous.

I know this river does have mercury issues, and people arent' supposed to eat fish caught from the river more than twice a week.

I have fed our alligators and caimens fish from the river, they really love it. I talked to a lot of reptile people that I respect, before I had the guts to feed something from the river, unfrozen, to our reptiles. Freezing really compromises the vitamins and nutrients in fish (especially the B vitamins, if memory serves).

Not one person mentioned lead or mercury, I am glad you did Steve.

We also have been thinking about catching crayfish, also found in this river, to the diets of some of our larger crocodillians and varanids. I am thinking that since they are a bottom feeder (atleast I thought they were), they may harber some of the filtered toxins in the water. I have read that crayfish mainly eat fresh fish.

We also have a lot of clams in the river.

I am really nervous to try any foods I collect, but I would like to add the varitty of grasshoppers, fresh fish, crayfish and maybe clams to the diet of some of our animals.

Sheila once fed a frozen (thawed) smelt from a bait store, to a 5' roughneck monitor - and found it dead and bloated the next morning. Since then we are leary too of our source of frozen fish.

I keep being told that I am overly paranoid about this, but it has been working for us so far. Again, I am a big fan of variety, and fresh food - so I am torn between the two trains of thought.

Ryan

[Scales Zoo]

Also, we have a few frogs, and tiger salamanders by the thousands. I have been offered many of these free, but have turned them down because I couldn't bring myself to causing the death of our native amphibians.

Saskatchewan is like a desert, when it rains like it did this spring we have an amphibian explosion.

I was also not sure about possible parasite concerns, or other concerns surrounding the practise of feeding wild amphibians to captive reptiles.

Ryan

[B-Rep]

I had experienced this same problem around 1999 with a small Jobiensis...I looked into it found out about the elevated glucose level...After nearly loosing my female I decided against feeding frogs all together before June and after September.

Thanks for posting that Steeve, it's good info to have.

[Kyle Barker]

So if i went out and caught a bunch of bulls tomarrow, it should be safe right?

[Steeve B]

You need to know if where your getting them is safe, and if your going to freeze them you need to eviscerate and clean them prior to freezing, if the led- mercury is high in your area you can let the frogs soak in a bucket of milk few hours, that’s a trick they use to ride of any toxins in frogs legs.
Rgds

[Kyle Barker]

Cool, last question i promise :D

Do you need to "gut" them if feeding live? Can you feed live (if from a clean area)?

[Steeve B]

Yes absolutly!
feed them live!