Too Late to "Tame" My Yellow Anaconda?

[Neon Aurora]

Hello all. I joined a few months back but had a rough semester at university so didn't find the time to really join in. I have one burning question. First let me explain my situation.

I'm 21 years old and got a yellow anaconda when I was 16. It probably wasn't the smartest decision I've ever made, but I will say I made it work. I've had the snake for 5 years now and she is healthy, so I can't have done that bad of a job. Anyways, I wasn't all that experienced with snakes when I got her. I'm honestly more of a gecko person. But, I got her (she was sold to me as female, I have no idea if she actually is and probably never will) when she was just a tiny snake. As far as I'm aware, she was captive bred (she was labeled as such and I don't have any major reason not to believe it). She was very bite-y from the very start. I tried handling her for a while to get her habituated, but after I continued to get bit over and over and reading that they are just nasty by nature (which I know isn't true now, but I believed it then) I started using snake hooks. I've used snake hooks ever since. I would like to get the point where I can at least pick her up and move her without snake hooks so I can clean her tank and whatnot.

The question is: Is it too late for her to become able to be handled with bare hands? Did my lack of ability as a teenager to deal with her make her impossible to handle? She's rather keen on striking repeatedly at me if I get near her. I can usually work inside the take without removing her if I stay far enough away. If I get too close, she'll bite me.

I mean, I suppose I've gotten pretty used to the snake hooks, so if I have to use them for the rest of her life, than no biggie. She isn't really a problem to move around. I feel like it would be nicer for me and for her if I could handle her though. Than I wouldn't have to mess with snake hooks and she wouldn't need to be stressed about my presence (she does tend to coil when I reach the snake hooks in).

I feel bad that I made irresponsible decisions as a young person, but I'm determined to keep this snake as happy and healthy as possible until the end of her life regardless.

Any input is appreciated.

[bigsnakegirl785]

It's not advisable and irresponsible not to use hooks with a giant. No matter how docile she ever gets, you should continue using hooks. We're talking a snake with the potential to send you to the hospital or kill you, a hook is a very good way to remind her that it's you.

That said...you aren't actually picking her up with the hooks, are you? At most, you should only use it to move parts of her body around, like dragging her towards you or moving a coil out of the way, but you can damage her organs actually lifting her up on a hook.

[Neon Aurora]

Well she really isn't that big, first off. I haven't measured her, but I don't really think she is over 6-7 feet (maybe she is a he?).

Anyways, I use two hooks to support as much body as possible and I don't really think I have a choice but to pick her up with them. I need to clean her tank and to do that she needs to be out or I'll just get bit repeatedly. She's very messy and I need to get in there to scrub and disinfect.

I've never heard anyone say before that you should always use hooks, but if that is indeed the case, than I will continue to use hooks. I would appreciate any suggestions on how to care for her probably without moving her with the hooks if it is really that bad. Because at this point, I just can't think of any other way that I could safely keep her home clean. As I said before, I can work with her in there if I'm far away. I can at least remove her water tub to clean and change without fuss. But getting feces from the substrate or scrubbing it from the walls is more dangerous.

[Albert Clark]

Kudos to you for keeping a giant for so long! Especially one species that is known to be hard to handle and more of the aggressive nature. It's always safer to have a second person with you at all times when going in to the enclosure. So that will be a must do for you from now on. As bsg said you have to continue with the hook due to the massive size and potential danger the animal poses. I think if these giants are underfed can also be a trigger for them to be unhappy. Are you feeding the animal adequately? They really need a appropriate sized meal to be satiated. At about 5 years old I would think she/he is rather small at 6 feet. So, adequate feeding is a good place to start in the taming process. No, it's not too late however. Good luck and keep us posted.

[Kokorobosoi]

Hmm...I don't actually use them, but some of my hooks have a rubbery end... It's for controlling the head.

Personally with my cranky boa I just nudge her head with the hook, push her away so I can reach in and get a coil. If you control the head you control the biting. Before she decides to get cranky I'm already moving her head away. I KNOW she will try once or twice so I just don't give her a chance.

But as others have said, if you have a large, cranky animal it's a two person job. Safe, responsible keeping is a must. Even my boas push the limit of what I consider a one person job. Do you have someone nearby that at the very least will act as your safeguard?

Sorry if I sound harsh, but I don't play around with safety.

[Neon Aurora]

Thanks for the replies.

I am absolutely here to learn and willing to take all advice. I do have people living with me, so while someone isn't always in the same room, they are usually a room over. But if you think she really could pose a danger to me, than I will start asking someone to stay in the room with me while I work in her enclosure.

So of course if the picking her up using the hooks could be damaging, I will stop doing it. I hate to admit that I wasn't aware it was dangerous. Could someone please give me more information on controlling the head? It sounds awfully difficult to control the head with one hand while also cleaning with the other. And what about when I need to change the substrate completely out and do a deep cleaning? What is the best way to remove her to do so?

I know that she seems a little small for her age, but I assure you I've always fed her well. While she was still small I fed her weekly. Once she started getting bigger, she stopped being interesting in eating weekly, so I started feeding her every two weeks. Currently she gets a jumbo rat (approximately 1.5 times her body girth) every two weeks. However, she reduced her eating habits over the winter and hasn't come out of it yet, so she has been refusing more often lately. Other than that, she's never missed a meal and she looks to be of good weight to me. In other words, I realize that she is small for her age, but I honestly don't know why.

[Albert Clark]

Thanks for the replies.

I am absolutely here to learn and willing to take all advice. I do have people living with me, so while someone isn't always in the same room, they are usually a room over. But if you think she really could pose a danger to me, than I will start asking someone to stay in the room with me while I work in her enclosure.

So of course if the picking her up using the hooks could be damaging, I will stop doing it. I hate to admit that I wasn't aware it was dangerous. Could someone please give me more information on controlling the head? It sounds awfully difficult to control the head with one hand while also cleaning with the other. And what about when I need to change the substrate completely out and do a deep cleaning? What is the best way to remove her to do so?

I know that she seems a little small for her age, but I assure you I've always fed her well. While she was still small I fed her weekly. Once she started getting bigger, she stopped being interesting in eating weekly, so I started feeding her every two weeks. Currently she gets a jumbo rat (approximately 1.5 times her body girth) every two weeks. However, she reduced her eating habits over the winter and hasn't come out of it yet, so she has been refusing more often lately. Other than that, she's never missed a meal and she looks to be of good weight to me. In other words, I realize that she is small for her age, but I honestly don't know why.
Honestly, i think you need someone with you IN the enclosure with you possibly to contain the head but the whole animal for sure. This cant be a one handed operation any longer! You have to think SAFETY from now on. Good job though. This will also play into the taming process.

[Neon Aurora]

Understood. That might be a little more challenging. The people I live with aren't exactly reptile people and may not be comfortable in the enclosure with me.

I would be grateful for more information on safer handling. Would one person control the snake while the other does whatever needs to be done in the enclosure? I suppose I never really thought about it as long as I was careful. Even in the times I have been bitten, it was definitely a defensive maneuver on her part. She would strike a few times (she never hit me more than once, though) and go back into the traditional S shape. She never tried to hold on or wrap around my arm or anything like that. I think she's not so much aggressive as she is defensive.

I've actually heard a few different opinions now. I had an internship in animal care in California where I was able to talk to the person who deals with all of the reptiles (large or venomous snakes or otherwise) about the handling of my yellow. She recommended me to get her docile for safety but to also use snake hooks the way I have been. She didn't have a snake on the scale of an anaconda, though. She never mentioned having another person with me, so I suppose I never thought about it.

[Aaron_S]

Alright here's some tips based on the info you've presented. Good job done thus far by the way and kudos to you to being open minded.

1. Hooks are fine. They have "large snake hooks" as well. You can probably find them online. The differences being the material is obviously made for a heavier work load as well as the "hook" part is wider so it supports more body and doesn't do the damage that is being spoken of.
In addition, if you use your hooks closer to the mid-section of the body you'll miss the organs. They generally are all in the first third or so of their body.

2. To properly handle her without hooks might be possible. It might not be. Don't count on it is my guess. What you can do though is, and you may be able to as of now, is when you go in the enclosure use the hook to let him/her know you're there and use it to manipulate the body and start pulling her/him out. You can then lift her out with your hands. Or use one hook and one hand.

If the snake is super snappy and goes for you every time this method may not work for you. I'm hoping the snake is generally just uneasy and if you use the hooks to get to the body and lift her out and put her in a holding bin you should be fine.

3. Yes, you should have someone around the house for safety reasons. You don't need them in the enclosure. In the room is fine aslong as you're hooking/moving the snake between holding bins. Once it's secure it's fine. If they step away for any reason just ensure that they come back and check on you. It doesn't matter if someone is on the house when you're working with the animal if they can't hear you cause the snake got you and you're passed out.

[jpsteele80]

Absolutely not to late, i got a (around 6 or 7ft at the time) burm from a pet store when i was 16, not the brightest move on my behalf either. The snake had not been handled from what the owner said in almost 2yrs except cleaning and even then it wasn't hands on, basically putting up a board cleaning half the cage them getting it to move to the other side and boarding it and that's it. It took me a while to break that snake but eventually it was one of the best snakes i ever had.

[Kokorobosoi]

I just fed my male, and my female is possibly gravid so I don't want to stress her, or I would video what I'm talking about, in regards to head control. As long as you don't laugh tomorrow I'll try showing it with one of the babies I have.

[Kokorobosoi]

And to be clear, not anacondas. But same principle applies.

[bigsnakegirl785]

Well she really isn't that big, first off. I haven't measured her, but I don't really think she is over 6-7 feet (maybe she is a he?).

Anyways, I use two hooks to support as much body as possible and I don't really think I have a choice but to pick her up with them. I need to clean her tank and to do that she needs to be out or I'll just get bit repeatedly. She's very messy and I need to get in there to scrub and disinfect.

I've never heard anyone say before that you should always use hooks, but if that is indeed the case, than I will continue to use hooks. I would appreciate any suggestions on how to care for her probably without moving her with the hooks if it is really that bad. Because at this point, I just can't think of any other way that I could safely keep her home clean. As I said before, I can work with her in there if I'm far away. I can at least remove her water tub to clean and change without fuss. But getting feces from the substrate or scrubbing it from the walls is more dangerous.

6'-7' is definitely big enough to require a hook, although it may not send you to the hospital.

I'd invest in gloves to move her, even a 6' anaconda is too big to be resting its entire body on a hook. A wider hook like mentioned may work, but investing in some heavy gloves can often help to get a snake used to hands-on handling, although the initial switch to bare skin might spook them. Heavy gloves can be ungainly, but it should be ok if all you're doing is moving it out of the enclosure.

Yellows are small, but 6'-7' still seems on the small side for a yellow of that age, even for a male. It may be in the average, just on the smaller side of average. At this age, it's probably safe to say the snake won't get big enough to face the danger of a full-sized giant.

[dannybgoode]

Bear in mind snakes never truly get tame, merely tolerant of handling. Some species more than others can be pretty docile, others not so much.

Yellow anacondas are in the not so much category and it might be even if you have tried to handle your snake every day since it was born it would still be a snappy, grumpy thing.

As others have said you definitely need a second pair of hands on standby. You might never need them but if you did and they weren't there you could be in trouble.

[Neon Aurora]

Thank you for all of the useful information.

Based on all of this, here is what I'm going to do:

1) I will start making safety a bigger priority. I don't think it would be fair to the people I live with to ask them to work so closely with a snake they're not comfortable with, but I will definitely ask someone to be present and ready to help me if anything happens, and I will no longer interact with the snake when no one is home or able to keep an eye on me.

2) I will get a pair of heavy duty gloves and begin practicing having more control with the hook. Based on her behavior, I think it is a reasonable expectation to get her to where I can gain control of her head with the hook and pick up the back part of her body with my gloved hand. This should eliminate risk to her body while also protecting me from getting bit.

3) I will measure and weight her. I just took a guess on how long she is, but now I feel like I should measure her so I'm not reporting inaccurate information. It might be kind of hard, but I'll figure it out.

If she is 6-7 feet, would this be a good indicator that the snake is actually male? I would like to know, but traditional ways of checking aren't going to fly with this one.

[Albert Clark]

That sounds like a great start to the taming process. Safety is always a priority with all snakes, especially the "giants" and the venomous. The most definitive way to determine sex in snakes is by way of "probe" in a large snake like yours." Popping" is another way way its done in smaller and younger animals.

[Neon Aurora]

I did know both of those methods, I just don't think I'll ever be able to perform them because "she" is so snappy.

[IW17]

6-7' is very small for a female. Don't put too much faith in what sex it was sold to you as. Especially from a seller willing to sell a yellow Anaconda to an inexperienced 16 year old kid. I've had many snakes sold to me as one, turn out to be the other. Not a huge deal as I'm not a breeder, but it shows how often it can happen. You seem like you've done one heck of a job so far, and it's great you're still willing to ask questions. I would add to wear gloves as mentioned above. Biggest reason is body heat. You might be able to handle without triggering a defensive reaction if the snake doesn't detect your body heat from the gloves being on. Definitely worth a try at least.

[Neon Aurora]

Yeah, my rosy boa was actually sold to me as male. I took her to my favorite local reptile shop when she was grown to be probed, and they said "he" was definitely female. So I wouldn't be surprised at all if this one turned out male. At this point I'm guessing that it is male because of the size. I certainly agree with you about not trusting a source that sold a 16 year old an anaconda. I would love to know for sure, though. I've gotten so used to calling the snake a she, it might be hard to switch over!

I would also really like to measure him/her. I went in there with a flexible tape measure earlier hoping to get close enough to get a rough estimated, but he/she was not having it. Any tips on how I might be able to get a decently accurate size measurement without too much stress? My brainstorming hasn't come up with much. A long, clear tube would be nice. I could gently coax her in it and measure her straight in the tube. But I don't have a 7 foot long clear tube lying around. Even just an approximate measurement to the nearest foot would be enough.

Other question... Most people here have mentioned his (I supposed I might as well switch to the pronoun of the most probably gender) size. Should I worry if he is small for his age?

By the way, I want to thank this forum for not flaming me. Sometimes things can get so heated when it comes to ethics with animals that those of us who have made stupid decisions (and realize it!) can have trouble finding help to make the best of a situation. So thanks! I've received some great advice already and even some encouragement despite my mistake as a teenager. =)

[Kokorobosoi]

There is a site with this measuring uh... Thing. You take a photo of the snake next to an item you know the size of. Then you make points all along the snake and it measures it compared to the known item.

On my phone so I can't find it.... Snake widget? I'm sure someone here knows what I'm talking about

[Kokorobosoi]

Serpwidgets!!

Google is my friend

[Albert Clark]

Koko, can you take a picture next to like say, a 12" ruler?

[Andy_G]

A big male yellow would be 8 to 9 feet. Yours isn't sounding that undersized for a male yellow. Really doubt it's a female, though.

[Neon Aurora]

That tool was very useful, thanks.

According to the measuring tool, he is only 5.5 feet. I always thought he was small, but I didn't know he was that small. I don't understand why. =/ He's always had enough food and he's always been kept at the right temperatures.

I took a picture next to a 12 inch ruler, and it seemed to work fine.

[bigsnakegirl785]

That tool was very useful, thanks.

According to the measuring tool, he is only 5.5 feet. I always thought he was small, but I didn't know he was that small. I don't understand why. =/ He's always had enough food and he's always been kept at the right temperatures.

I took a picture next to a 12 inch ruler, and it seemed to work fine.

I have had trouble getting accurate measurements with SerpWidgets. I know for a fact my boa is 6'5". Last time I measured him, he was 6'3", but SerpWidgets said he was barely 5'. If you don't get the picture absolutely flat with no distortion, the photo could be off.

It could also be accurate, do you have any photos of the snake on someone or next to a universal object that we could judge the size from? I'm sure we could tell you if it's in the 6'+ range or 6'- range, even if we couldn't get it exact.

[Neon Aurora]

I can provide a picture. However, he will almost certainly be coiled up. I can never get him to stretch out any. He's very defensive. Will a picture of him bunched up still work?

[bigsnakegirl785]

I can provide a picture. However, he will almost certainly be coiled up. I can never get him to stretch out any. He's very defensive. Will a picture of him bunched up still work?

Yeah, as long as there's something universally recognized nearby.

[Neon Aurora]

Okay. I will post one later this evening.

[Albert Clark]

I have had trouble getting accurate measurements with SerpWidgets. I know for a fact my boa is 6'5". Last time I measured him, he was 6'3", but SerpWidgets said he was barely 5'. If you don't get the picture absolutely flat with no distortion, the photo could be off.

It could also be accurate, do you have any photos of the snake on someone or next to a universal object that we could judge the size from? I'm sure we could tell you if it's in the 6'+ range or 6'- range, even if we couldn't get it exact.

Thanks for that information. It was helpful.

[Neon Aurora]

Alright, here's a picture. My camera kind of sucks in low lighting, so I had no choice but the use the flash. He's very reflective, so sorry about the image quality. His colors are a bit washed out because of the flash.

That is a regular 12 inch ruler in the picture with him.

http://i.imgur.com/9lTuhFv.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/HXhTijB.jpg (http://imgur.com/HXhTijB)

[bigsnakegirl785]

Oh yeah definitely 6' or under. Honestly, I think SerpWidgets is correct in guessing that it's 5.5'. Looks in good condition, and if you're feeding it jumbo/x-large or whatever it's not being underfed. Must just be a small individual.

[dannybgoode]

Like people some snakes are just smaller. Looks healthy to me so I wouldn't worry about size...

[Nightflight99]

Like people some snakes are just smaller. Looks healthy to me so I wouldn't worry about size...

Danny is right on the money here. It is silly to be dogmatic about what size a snake is "supposed to be." Your anaconda looks very healthy, and its actual size is really secondary.

Regarding the "taming" of this snake: like all snakes, anacondas can be conditioned to a number of things. While many individuals may never be fully trusted, most can be conditioned to tolerate handling, at least to some degree. Since snakes are creatures of habit, it would be a great idea to develop a routine every time the snake is being removed for maintenance. This can involve something like nudging the snake with a hook prior to removing it from the enclosure, for example. Obviously, the later in life that conditioning occurs, the more difficult it can be to achieve the desired results. I've worked in the past with adult wild-caught boas that seemed nearly impossible to condition, at least short of making that a full-time effort. This is going to vary by individual, but chances are that you are able to at least produce some improvements.

Lastly, about the use of hooks on large constrictors: most hooks do not offer a substantial amount of surface area, so if the body of a large constrictor is resting on it, it places a lot of pressure on a very small part of the body, which can be problematic if it occurs for a significant amount of time. That said, large adult constrictors are not easy to hook in the first place, because they are a) heavy as hell, and b) extremely strong, and can easily wrestle the hook away from you. The temptation to use a hook in a manner that is detrimental to the well-being of the snake is therefore pretty limited. Also, a 5-6 ft individual does not have the amount of mass to make handling with a hook a significant risk factor. As a suitable alternative, you may want to consider a hook that is specifically designed for that purpose, such as the python hook produced by Midwest (http://tongs.com/pythonhook.aspx). It is a beast of a hook, and makes you look like you're ready to invade Russia, but it does an okay job at what it was designed for.

Personally, my preferred method of handling large anacondas is to use a hook and let the snake know that it is about to be handled (rather than fed), then use it to pull the tail toward me. After I have control of the tail, I gently begin to pull the snake's body (by hand), which causes most individuals to look for an object or part of the enclosure to hook onto and keep from being moved. If the snake begins to get defensive and strike, I use a long hook to try and discourage the head from launching into a strike. This works well for individuals up to about 10 ft in length, and does so without resting any significant portion of the body on the hook. After that, I like to have a spotter available who can take over the job of watching/controlling the head.

Hope this helps.

[Neon Aurora]

Okay. I have absolutely no problem with small size. I was only concerned about his health. But if he's healthy, than I'm happy!

I'll definitely work on my handling technique. I'll get some thick gloves and use my hands more. I just hope I'm good enough with the hook to not get bit. He's very good at striking backwards.

I have a pretty good hook. I had it custom made by a good friend who is fond of metal working.