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Old 01-05-03, 06:18 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Angry Attention AOL users and herp lovers

I posted this add on AMERICA ONLINE ( AOL) TO the Host and or Moderators of this form

I am relatively new to the keeping of reptiles and have been looking for advice on many topics in relations to reptiles and amphibians. Though there seams to be many books to read I would like to try and get help here as its easier than trying to find all the books, Can you tell me first though what your credentials are I.E. Years of experience and types of animals you have kept. Also education levels. Degrees in Herpetology. Field work done, Papers written, books published and some if any lectures you have done for the scientific community. I ask these questions because it seams to me many books out there are written by amateur herpetologist with no true background of scientific knowledge. In fact many of them seam to contradict one another and I am looking for people who really know what there doing. I would assume and hope that for AOL to allow you on here you have the experience but for my animals well being I need to be sure the people I get the information from are not just amateurs with there own opinions.

Thank you for your time and response.

Now this is the respoce that i recieved

Dear Member,

Regarding your message posted at AOL Keyword: Reptiles community>Reptile Open Discussion>Re: To the Host and Moderators

In order for all members to enjoy our message boards, our community has certain standards of conduct for members to follow. Please review AOL Keyword: Message Board Product Guidelines and AOL Keyword: Home Board Standards for information on what is appropriate in our community. Based on these standards and guidelines, your post was removed to avoid disruption to the message board discussion.

Depending on the severity of the disruption, a report may have been submitted to AOL's Community Action Team for further review.

We appreciate your taking the time to read this letter. Thank you. If you have any questions or comments, please forward them to HOST PETS Mgr.

Regards,

HOST PETS PetVet
Volunteer Message Board Leader
Pets Community

I am not sure about the rest of you or how you feel about people giving out advice on herp care but i think that if they are giving it out where millions of people can read it they should have some basic knowledge.
All your opinions are very welcomed. also several people replied to what i wrote before AOHELL decided to pull the thread. and all were given the same TOS letter, if you want i will post what they said as well as the same borring TOS letter.

Thank you all
Scott Bice
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Old 01-05-03, 06:52 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Hmm.. Exactly how is this particular post in TOS violation? Looks to me that he is just looking for valid information from individuals that have actual experience in these fields.
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Old 01-05-03, 07:42 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I'm not sure why you posted this on here, or rather what you were looking to hear in reply.. However, from my experience with AOL, the members that frequent their message boards are people like you and I, people in the hobby.. Im sure some of them have degrees etc. However, most of them are just people who own herps.. So im not sure why you assumed the people on there that post are professionals.. They are all just giving out information that they have picked up along the way aswell as from their OWN experience..
As for why your post was removed, I'm sure it was looked at as an attack against the members who frequent those boards.. Personal attacks are against AOL's TOS (Terms Of Service).. I hope this shed some light on this situation you have found yourself in..
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Old 01-05-03, 09:07 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Matt . I wish to thank you for your reply however i am not sure where in the article I attacked any member, I was just looking to verify the host and moderators of AOL and the credintials for giving advice to people on reptiles.

I would check out doctors and vets before going to them or asking there advice.

As to the reason I posted here. I frequent this site and have noticed many good people on it and was wonderring if anyone could shed light on why a question that was purely designed to check the credentials of someone giving out care and husbandry of reptiles. would constitute a terms of service violation on that or anysite .

However since that posting many people have contacted me and informed me of there own problems relating to ever doing anything on AOLs boards. Seams there moderators do as they wish when they wish and have no true standard .

I do wish to thank you again for shedding a little more light on how they may have took it.

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Old 01-05-03, 09:55 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Well Scott, unfortunatly if you are looking for a vets information you are looking in the wrong places. When you go to a reptile community online, what you are going to find is hobbyists and collectors who are sharing what they have tried and what they find works best for there animals. Someone who has been keeping reptiles for 10+ Years probably has more hands on experience then 90% of the vets in the USA or Canada. the information that people post is to be reviewed and used with your discretion. I hope that made some sense. If you would like a vets opinion on something there are many of them around, but to be honest with you, i would trust the opinions of some of these community members over the opinion of 95% of the vets in my area, who really are going to give me opinions out of a book, because 99% of their buisness is Cats and Dogs.
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Old 01-06-03, 06:53 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Well you are here and you post here and you read posts here.So you are part of the family here.I would ask why would you look any further for reptile information than this site? Now before you kick me in the "goodies", it's true we can never have all the info everyone wants or needs ,but we will offer all that we have to who ever we see is asking for info.I will leave my opinion of aol elsewere just because!!!! Did you know this site is the brain child of Jeff ******** and through his efforts (and his wallett lol) we have the honour of belonging to the best reptile site on the web.



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Old 01-06-03, 06:59 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Jeff
I whole heartedly agree with you on your point. My entire wish was to hear what the credentials of the person giving out the advice was . Even if all they said was they only had 2 ,5 10, 15 years. Unfortunately it seams as though instead of trying to help and answer a simple question all they could do was pull the add saying it was disruptive, I do have thank god some of the best vets IE keepers with many years under their belt helping me when i need it and do so appreciate all their hard earned free time they share with me.
It is a true testimate to the love these people have for the hobby that most would help out someone else just because they care about the animals they keep.
and yes ive always asked them the same questions i asked in my posting and have been amazed at how they told me freely and openly its something they are proud of as a rule. I guess though some people arnt or maybe there hiding something who knows lol.
Thanks Jeff
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Old 01-11-03, 04:33 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Scott, I am aware of your situation, and I too would question the credentials of a moderator who claims to have proper medical knowledge, who advises giving a 2 pound snake a dose of panacure that would be appropriate for a full grown horse (as I understand was done). So you are not wrong to question people who offer medical advice like that. I too would question my doctor if he told me to take 53,000 mg of cipro for a common cold (this is an exageration, but see the point to it). Just my two cents (now give me my change).
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Old 01-11-03, 05:14 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I was not aware of the panacure situation before i posted my reply.. So yes, i agree you have every right to question this person's knowledge and credentials.
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Old 01-11-03, 08:38 PM   #10 (permalink)
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The understanding that I have about the moderators of AOL (which I dropped like a bad habit a while back!!!) are actually mostly animal rights activists that want to ban private ownership of herps. This is just what I have been reading, so take it for what it is, second hand talk.

I personally can't stand AOL, and since I got a cable modem, I will never use AOL agian.(NOT just for this reason, either)
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Old 01-12-03, 12:37 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Animal rights activivist that explains a lot lmao.

I would buy that and not bet against it. I have posted several more articles and gosh gee imagine that they removed them. Including one that was giving advise to parents to research the information on the animal there child wants to buy and have the child research it also before purchasing.

This is getting to be a joke for me, I did contact AOL and was informed by them that the Host themsleves " APPEAR " to be in violation of the terms of service but it takes time to solve the problem , hmm sounded like snake droppings to me.

I also am Highly curious as to whom one of the Host is as all the links she/he gives to back his / her statements are directly to Melissa Kaplans care sheets. I am thankful for people like the ones here who obviously care about the herps and the questions asked.

Thank all

Scott
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Old 01-12-03, 08:48 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Yes, I use to post on AOL message boards, but the only good information there applies to VERY novice herpers, like people who buy a snake on a whim and then don't know what to do when they get home. I stoped posting when a group of "know-it-alls" started posting insulting replies to messages, calling hobbiests who were trying to help "stupid". It took the hosts months to actually remove these posts and they didn't do much to control the issue.

Many of the hosts claim to have everything from medical degrees to years of knowledge, but I saw people who had only kept snakes a few years giving better information. Some of the hosts even kept pe rats and had issues with posts concerning feeding snakes.
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