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Old 12-30-02, 07:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Why do they have controll????

Do u agree that we should be able to own things that are controlled???????
What right does someone have to come and say that we can't own a snake or a certain kind of dog? A columbian red tail gets just about as long and a Burmese python.... An english bull mastiff gets 3 times the size of a pit bull and they could do just as much damage!!!!!
**** I don't think that every Tom, **** and Harry should own one but I do think that if u want to own one u should have to get papers (snakes)..... *** It depends how it is brought up too.... If you never touch it, then you can't expect it to be nice....
***** Its just like them banning pit bulls..It depends on how they are brought up... just because they are called a pit bull, doesn't mean that its going to chew someones arm off.... both these animals I talk about, I have had experience with and think they are great animals.... please write and let me know what you think....I talked to Alberta Fish And Wildlife today and they said that the reptile society okayed the list in 97,but the thing is that some people in the Edmonton Society own BURMESE.I was not an avid collector of reptiles in 97,so why should I have to abide by a rule set in 97 that does not make sense.There is no law saying I can own a poodle,but I can't own a great dane.even though the only reason the bylaw officer said that burms,and retics are illegal is because of the size they get to.

Let me know your opinion because I am in the process of talking with my MLA.
 
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Old 12-30-02, 08:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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The government has always had control of what you can keep and can't keep, they just don't enforce it until people cause them to step in by keeping animals irresponsibly.
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Old 12-30-02, 08:30 PM   #3 (permalink)
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well a Columbian (now matter how big it gets will never be as big as a berm) I keep columbians and have had a few large ones over the years.Biggest female I have ever seen was about 9 feet or so and she was freeking huge. I have heard and read of the northern most form of the columbian can hit 10 feet but that would be rare.Most true redtails don't hit 10 feet. Average size for a large boa of any species would be about 7-8 feet.I think (I am not a python person) berms and retics are more like the 14-15 foot range and can hit 20 feet well that is not "just about as long as a burmeese python" There is though a retic called a dwarf which is more the size of a boa I am told but I hear they are hard to find.


I agree some laws aren't fair but that is life, you can thank the dummies and morons of the world who. #1 had these animals before you had interest. #2 let these animals escape or run wild #3 have people injured due to these animals .# 4 not been prepared to take proper care of the animal,so shelters and rescues get them. #5 bringing negative press to the aforementioned animals. The press loves these type of stories for the news and for the front page so thank the morons of the world for what you have to live with.


Hats off to the respectable pet owners we are becoming few and far between now days, we owe our animals and ourselves the respect and the care required to allow us to remain a part of the community.


2 cents and a shot of wiskey !!!!!

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Old 12-30-02, 11:38 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Hip???

Hip,I am asking for peoples OPINIONS not ATTITUDES.I am glad that you have only owned columbians that have reached 9-10 feet,but I know somebody who has one that is 12 feet (which in my books is pretty close to 15 feet).I am glad that you feel like you have to go along with everybody else,but that is why we have the freedom of speech and the right to vote.Think of it this way,you know how you are calling people morons for letting the laws pass in 97,well I think that if you don't want to fight for your right to own things like dwarf retics that get to 10 feet because the government said so than you are a moron too.

Everybody has an opinion and I am glad you do,but try not to come across as such a know it all.
 
Old 12-31-02, 12:30 AM   #5 (permalink)
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...

You want an opinion? I say they should police biggie snakes. There's far too many dumb people to handle what it takes to keep one adequately. But can they do it effectively?

Probably not.

And of course the only reason people can't own Burms and Retics is size. Why else? I don't get that observation.

But to ask why they have control is like asking why there is laws. I like anarchy and chaos as much as the next person, but I'm still a wreckless youth with strange ideals and fringe morals (regarding humans). Not everyone should own a Retic. Even I can see that. Just like we shouldn't own Tigers, Komodos, Perenties, Mugger Crocs, Bald Eagles, Blue Whales, T-Rex's etc etc etc. I'm glad for laws that keep those things out of the general public's hands. Aren't you?

And dude, Hip's opinion was a good one. So good, I read it twice. And I think you should too. He never said it was moronic people who passed the laws in '97. He said it was morons who could house the animals properly that CAUSED the laws to be passed. It didn't have attitude, it had fact. And his opinion was based on that fact. What's yer problem?
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Old 12-31-02, 01:29 AM   #6 (permalink)
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of course

Am I saying that every Tom,****,or Harry should be allowed to own one....uh no!I am saying that we should be able to obtain special permits(just like pitbull owners in Edmonton) have to.So you agree that laws should not be changed?I suppose women should still not have the right to vote then.I am saying that if you have the knowledge and the proper housing for something like a burmese python,why should you not be allowed to own one???Just because some moron goes out drinking and driving,should driving or drinking be banned...NO!But just because some people do stupid things with some types of snakes,I can't own one?Yet in B.C. they can own pretty much anything.
 
Old 12-31-02, 02:55 AM   #7 (permalink)
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....

If it can be properly done (ie, take a test, show them the intended cages, etc etc) then permits would be the best thing to hit this hobby in a long time.

That's what we should be pushing for. Its the only thing that'll make us seem legit (in their eyes) and it'll give them the control they want.
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Old 12-31-02, 10:15 AM   #8 (permalink)
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In rebuttal

Thanks jeff for keeping the faith and pulling for me. Well show me the 12 footer with true tape measurement and I will buy it for cash! "I am a moron! and I do now have an attitude" You sir or mam posted for opinnions and when people post opinnions you insult said people.Thusly I can only see you posting the aforementioned article to start an argument well I have no desire to argue and of course being a "moron" I do not have the required intellegence to argue with a superior being like your self.

I only hope in your stumbling around you do not wake the dragon


Happy New year


Signed Moron


peace to you jeff

ps were did I state that I only kept columbians?
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“You know its funny I was thinking about what you said. The preeminent truth of our age is that you can not fight the system. But if as you say the truth is fluid that the truth is subjective then maybe you can fight the system. As long as just one person refuses to be broken refuses to bow down” “But can you win?” “Every time I say NO”

Last edited by hip; 12-31-02 at 10:20 AM..
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Old 12-31-02, 10:27 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Well said, Jeff and hip! I loved hip's opinion so much I also read it several times. Two thirds of the large boids sold in my county end up in rescues, which is why the law was passed that folks in my city (Allentown, PA) cannot own one. We've been under this law for almost 40 years now, which is a crying shame. In fact, it's recently been rewritten to ban the sales of all constricting snakes, so now corns, kings, etc. are also banned for new keepers. Animal Control seems to be allowing folks who previously had these species to keep them, but on a case by case basis. 5 kingsnakes were seized from a home where they were not securely caged and a neighbor found one in her apartment.

But the lawmakers saw a lot of problems, and of course the responsible keepers who house their snakes properly and don't take them to the fair or the park to freak people out never make the press. They acted based on the knowledge they had at the time. The fact that their info was both incomplete and very anti-herp biased doesn't change that fact. The laws were written to try and solve a problem, not to infringe on people's rights.

If we wish to challenge those laws, we have to present our case very carefully. Gather good information and cases of responsible husbandry and don't just go off half-cocked or once again herpers will be seen as some fringe element that is possibly a danger to the public at large.
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Old 12-31-02, 01:04 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Well said eyespy. I have to agree with everything you said
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Old 01-01-03, 09:07 PM   #11 (permalink)
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another thing you got to understand is (at least in the states) petstores are still alowed to sell baby retics and burms you just arent alowed to keep them after a serten size. so what?? they arent gonna know you own one unless, yep you guessed it you do something ... Stupid! I own a burm and she my be only a year old now and trust me if i dident go to that reptile show and think what cute baby and buy it. I might not have it but hey thats my fault and.. hell she's still sweet as can be so I'll deal with it.. they dont make you fill out papers or get a permit yet I agree with jeff they should as long as they dont make you pay wich we all know they will and bla bla bla you all know how that go's. a lot of this boils down to: if there was less careless irsposable people in the world that have some misplaced disire to own reptiles or put short and sweet stupid people, their would be no gient pythons in the news, and most likely a lot fewer laws but hey stupid people make the world go round right?

P.S. dragons&balls: when mommy use to tell you treat others how you would like to be treated she was giveing good advice for the real world. in other words dont give additude in a post and not expect to recive it right back. sorry if that was too forward but I really thought you were getting alittle out of hand.
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Old 01-01-03, 09:10 PM   #12 (permalink)
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it would be good to have some sort of regulation regarding the keeping of giant snakes, but sa i said on another thread, who will do it?
dragons and balls what r u on? u started what could have been a good thread but u attack everyone who airs their views with childish malice. things do need to change but fighting between ourselves will not help our cause. would u prefer that there were no reptile shows? well if thats what u want go to england. every single one was closed down by the rspca who used incorrect facts and prejudices to force the local councils to buckle to "public safety"
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Old 01-01-03, 09:22 PM   #13 (permalink)
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wow poor people in england... I feel bad for them (sorry that had nothing to do with anything. )
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Old 01-01-03, 09:24 PM   #14 (permalink)
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dragons and balls: laws are laws dude, sometimes they may not be too just, but you have to deal with it. I dont agree with all the laws either, but like Jeff said, im glad that some animals are kept out of the publics hands.

reptiles are very misunderstood, you have to try to make people understand rather than just get angry with them.

there are plenty of districts that allow large snakes, so if you feel that strongly about it, move
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Old 01-02-03, 04:31 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Rant, rant, rant.

One last shout: no law in the world, in any government, is made for the intelligent. All laws are made for the lowest common denominator because the government has the job of protecting us from ourselves. [And before I get recoil from that statement - bear in mind that murder, rape, assault and other violent crimes are under that umbrella, as well as is legislation preventing hazardous animals from being kept by the mass population. Don't like your government in that position? Tough luck. Laws are made for the stupid, the irresponsible, and the violently insane.] Personally, I'd like to see a permit-and-testing system set up for exotic animals - ALL exotic animals, including low-end [uncomplicated husbandry] exotics such as cornsnakes. Take a short husbandry test, pay $15, earn the right to keep any cornsnake in any amount for life. Hell, I wouldn't even mind something like this being applied to human breeding.

Question #1: When your baby starts crying, do you
A) shake it violently until you break bones
B) try to figure out what's wrong
C) take another hit on the bong and wonder if you just drank the day's supply of breast milk.

...but that's giving the government just a bit too much credit.
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