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Old 05-31-04, 06:50 PM   #91 (permalink)
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I haven't had to ship any offspring yet as my creatures will not be breeding until this coming season, but what I was planning on was having a shipping AND handling charge all as one. Find out what it costs to overnight or same day the package, as well as the cost of packing/heating materials and add all of it as the shipping charge.

i.e.

A person is interested in one of my snakes and would like it shipped. If the actual shipping cost is $30 and the packaging is around $12, I would quote them at $45 in order to ensure that I would not be losing money by accomodating them by shipping a live animal.

As long as they know that the charge is for the box, styro, heat, shipping etc... then I would assume that would be fine. That is how I felt when I had my animals originally shipped to me.
Good post man. As long as you're honest and up-front about your business practices, NO ONE can complain. Good on you.
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Old 05-31-04, 06:53 PM   #92 (permalink)
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But cheap people will be cheap people I guess. I think that the prices of snakes should be higher. I don't think that (a lot) of times people are selling them for what they are worth any more
Hear hear!!! I can't think of a single animal (except some over-priced morphs) that are sold what they are "worth"!! I completely agree my man! GREAT post!!
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Old 05-31-04, 07:09 PM   #93 (permalink)
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I actually paid a $10 box charge on top of my $20 shipping cost.

I am willing to pay for box charges but I draw the line at paying a gas fee. That's really pushing it to me.
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Old 05-31-04, 07:47 PM   #94 (permalink)
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What determines what an animal is really worth??

Sorry to hijack.
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Old 05-31-04, 08:00 PM   #95 (permalink)
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What determines what an animal is really worth??
Too many factors to list, but all usually superceded by two things:

1) What the end consumer is willing to pay.

2) What the animal is "worth" to the breeder to keep and breed in the future.

But there are probably a thousand other factors to consider. Those are the two that I worry about more than all the others.
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Old 05-31-04, 08:11 PM   #96 (permalink)
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So who is to say, that snakes aren't being sold for what their worth now? If consumers set the price (and it's low), is that not really what the snake is worth if that's the price people are willing to buy at?

Just being devil's advocate. Trying to get an idea how people "price" things .
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Old 05-31-04, 08:20 PM   #97 (permalink)
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Well, look at Albinos in any breed.

20 years ago some of the albinos that are readily available today numbered in the single or double digits throughout the entire continent. So the demand far outstripped the quantity. As the numbers of offspring increased, and they became more common, the price dropped as people had more options to buy. It's the same with any market, be it oil, gold, or RAM.

RAM prices had been dropping steadily for years when the single largest producer of chips in Asia burned down in a fire. During their rebuild time, the amount of inventory in reserves dwindled rapidly and prices skyrocketed. Once the production was back, then prices dropped steadily once again.

It's all about supply and demand, and how much you need to sell in order to make a profit.
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Old 05-31-04, 08:23 PM   #98 (permalink)
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Katt- Yes and no. If we all agreed to hike up the price of our reptiles then people would still buy them. It would become "normal" to see higher prices at shows. Kind of like the ever fluctuating gas prices. Again, the problem lies with people who sell $100 animals for $25 and drive the market down for the rest of us. So really, animals aren't being sold for what they are worth, the are being "flogged".

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Old 05-31-04, 08:28 PM   #99 (permalink)
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Who's to say anything if that's the case. But it was our opinion, which I thought was implied. The dude and I thought that animals should be worth more than what they are being sold/traded for. No one is to say who's "right" about it. I think that living things that take time and effort to propogate and keep healthy should be more than $20 (corns, leo geckos, certain frogs, etc etc). Its my opinion.

I think that certain morphs are over-priced, but many will disagree. Who's right? Beats me. Maybe what people are willing to pay is the final bottom line. I price things with the market in mind and with quality in mind and with future production in mind. If people didn't want to pay $1500 for a male Pastel this year, then I would have 3 choices. Keep them all (yeah right). Sell them at the new low price (maybe if I was destitute and got myself in a bad situation with poor planning and financial management). Or I could flip them out of the country and let the people get them elsewhere. The market does NOT always determine what breeders sell their animals for. The market for an adult female Ball Python is probably $300, no more. I wouldn't sell any of mine for less than $1,000 each. Why would I? Market dictates what the price is, but breeders don't have to follow it. And more power to them for doing so. They're the ones doing all the work.
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Old 05-31-04, 08:31 PM   #100 (permalink)
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Katt- Yes and no. If we all agreed to hike up the price of our reptiles then people would still buy them. It would become "normal" to see higher prices at shows. Kind of like the ever fluctuating gas prices. Again, the problem lies with people who sell $100 animals for $25 and drive the market down for the rest of us. So really, animals aren't being sold for what they are worth, the are being "flogged".

Julie
PERFECT post. Ha ha, what I was trying to say in 1/10 of the "wordage".

LOL!
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Old 05-31-04, 08:36 PM   #101 (permalink)
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Originally posted by Jeff_Favelle
well when you pack up your animals and head to a show do you raise your prices to cover the cost of the trip???

Yep. Shows are RETAIL transations and each animal is around 10-15% higher. Go to ANY show and look at the prices, then look at a breeder's site for SIMILAR QUALITY and it'll be slightly higher. Always has been. There will be exceptions with people that have no name and can't move animals other than a show, but generally its a little higher at a show.

Who else does this. This is my 3rd time asking, I'd like to see you ignore it this time Favelle. grrrrrrrr

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Old 05-31-04, 08:43 PM   #102 (permalink)
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Ask the other breeders if you wanna know. When I was a youngin', before I attended my first show, it was on the advice of two large breeders attending the same show, and another large breeder NOT attending the show (or any show). I noticed it with other breeders (nor corns and leos mind you). I saw lower quality mid-range animals ($200-$500) being sold at a PREMIUM. The 6 shows that I've attended were like that.

Not sure why its such a point of interest, but ok. I wasn't ignoring it, I was just trying to make sure that I replied to everyone who actually acknowledged my original thread topic. There was a LOT of people replying and I was more concerned with making sure I touched base with them. If you were such a Curious George, why didn't you just email or PM. I answer my emails every day. Just ask around.
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Old 05-31-04, 08:59 PM   #103 (permalink)
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I have asked around, and I have found no one (not 1 person) who sells their snakes for more at shows, and I've been to far more than 6 shows. Personally, I consider the practise "gouging" - if you want to know my honest opinion, which I think was part of the original topic - I can go back and check.

Notice the smiley at the bottom of that post.

Also, let me say I think this is the first post on ssnakess to go above 100 that wasn't about hockey, or had broken out in a fight.

Ryan
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Old 05-31-04, 09:08 PM   #104 (permalink)
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I hear what you're saying guys, but hike the price all you want. People need gas to get to work, but people certainly do not need reptiles. Buyers will still dictate what you will sell at.

If I may recall albino whitesided ratsnakes. Easily one of the most expensive north american colubrids a couple years ago. Selling at $1200, no one wanted to buy. Prices dropped all over b/c no one was buying. Now they've settled in price and it's a heck of a lot less than $1200.

I think a lot has to do with popularity. Balls are popular, people know you can make money on them, so people spend money on them. However I dare not say to anyone, invest in an albino hognose, b/c frankly, you're not going to see returns on it, in Canada.


Sure breeders don't have to follow the market, but then, how will you make your money. In Canada you have the option to sell to the States, but, what if you're already an American?

As for $20 animals, I can understand, that yes, that's pretty darn cheap for a living creature, but there are so many corns, and leo's and etc, that people got to move them and the way to move them is to sell them cheap. Now we could say stop breeding, but that hasn't worked very well for cats and dogs, now has it?
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Old 05-31-04, 09:09 PM   #105 (permalink)
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I can't believe that so many people posted either! I thought Corey and Roy and maybe a noo-bee or two would have posted, ha ha! Its awesome! I think a LOT of good banter has gone back and forth. Its a great topic and I think its long overdue.
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