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Old 01-05-04, 03:05 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Nice post C.m.pyrrhus I totally agree.

If exposing children early doesn't have effect then why was Steve able to catch his first Brown Snake (highly venomous) at the age of FOUR? Did he learn a month earlier and go out and catch one? LOL doubt it. His parents raised him AT and IN the zoo, the woods and around venomous snakes since he was born. It obviously pays off or more of us would be out in Austrailia catching native herps right now like Steve is.

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Old 01-05-04, 03:29 PM   #47 (permalink)
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i agree with Tim and Julie.....
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Old 01-05-04, 03:31 PM   #48 (permalink)
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A dang good post, C.M. phyrrus! Both of them. Just what I wanted to say. The kids these days are growing up to be a bunch of wimps surrounded with safety regulations and all sorts of crap. Everything is off-limits. Its like you said, these kind of things happened on a regular basis 50 years ago, and nobody thought boo about it. Now we have a bunch of beurocratic idiots trying to tell us what we can and cannot do. I grew up in hill-billy country in North Carolina and as far back as I can remember, I went out in the woods by myself, went fishing by myself, did alot of stuff by myself. Of course, I always had the protection of my Daisy BB gun. Now if a kid goes into the woods by himself, his parents get arrested for child-endangerment. In 20 years, who knows, I might have to move to some third world country where I actually have freedom.

Back to the main topic. I dont think the point is that we all know everything about crocs, therefore worthy of deeming Steve's actions safe. The point is that Steve knows crocs like the back of his hands, and therefore he is worthy of deeming his actions safe. This is a croc thats been around people for a very long time. And this also is a croc that Steve has been around for a long time. Its by no means a docile animal, but its not straight from the wild either. It knows that Steve is the <i>source</i> of his food, not food himself. I doubt he would spend the energy attacking Steve for food when he knows all he has to do is wait for him to pull out a chicken.

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Old 01-05-04, 03:44 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Keeping reptiles in and of itself is a risk to infants and the young because they have the POTENTIAL of carrying SALMONELLA. Uh-oh, now we are all guilty of endangering our children!

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Old 01-05-04, 04:28 PM   #50 (permalink)
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hehe red bootz. You're avatar cracks me up. Spiderman 2 is going to rock!
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Old 01-05-04, 04:52 PM   #51 (permalink)
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C.m.pyrrhus, brilliantly said! You covered every single point I could have wished to bring accross. And mustang, I am in no way a venemous keeper, nor do I know anything about them, nor the practises in keeping them. However, common sense tells me Steve has been working with his hands FOREVER. I highely doubt he ever used the tools used now-a-days to hook dangerous snakes. All of his life has he been using his hands, now do you really think if he were to switch his methods, which again he has been doing for 30+ years, he would be equally as talented? I don't think so.
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Old 01-05-04, 04:58 PM   #52 (permalink)
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I dont think it was as bad as the press makes it out to be. Steve is pretty good at what he does, and you can bet he was really on his toes with his son with him. Should have been supporting the baby's head though. Dont get me wrong...I do think it was a supid thing to do. Even if he was in complete control of the croc (who knows?), the press and public are at least as dangerous and unpredictable.

Oh...for those of you who say our kids are being raised as wimps, the flip side is that infant and child mortality rates have been declining steadily. Deaths for children under age 1 have fallen steadily, for example, in the United States where it has gone from from 29/1000 in 1950 to 7/1000 in 2000. (http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0779935.html).

I'm not saying you're wrong, about coddling our kids...I'm just saying there's a trade-off.

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Old 01-05-04, 05:10 PM   #53 (permalink)
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The child mortality rates have declined, yes. But that has nothing to do with the way they are being raised up. It has to do with the new medications and the like that are available year after year.
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Old 01-05-04, 05:17 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Old 01-05-04, 06:29 PM   #55 (permalink)
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[sarcasm]Lets put all the children in plastic air tight bubbles so that they are never exposed to anything harmful. While we're at it lets paint the bubbles black so the child can't see anything traumatic. We should also install closed circuit tv's in the bubbles so we can provide the child with nothing but the most mindless programing so the child doesn't think or have low self esteem problems. Heaven forbid the child gets any form of stimulation.[/sarcasm]
Life is built on experiancing things, how many of you have seen a child burn or prick themselves after they've been told what they're going to touch is going to hurt just to see what it feels like? But everyone cries SAVE THE CHILDREN and we get stupid laws made and a million products that have insane prices because of the insurance needed to protect the company from the people too dumb to use them properly.
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Old 01-05-04, 06:56 PM   #56 (permalink)
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SO ur saying Mustangrde1.... That it was a horrible thing that Steve did.....SO if it was so ILLEGAL then why is it on camera and why isn't Steve in JAIL.....All people ever do is complain on how he handles his animals..... I personally would love to work and do the things he is able to do..... As for what he did with his kid... Why don't u try being a foster parent or someone that works with kids and then u tell me if that is the WORST thing that he could have done, believe me the horror stories are endless..... Maybe this is what his dad did to him?
Maybe he was just SHOWING OFF, but we all like to show things off when were VERY proud....
And if u still don't agree don't watch it!!!!
Its not that big of a deal.....

WELL PUT C.M. PYRRHUS
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Old 01-05-04, 07:21 PM   #57 (permalink)
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""" Not that big a deal""" that is the thought mentality that could cause us to loose many of our rights and abilities to keep reptiles.

As I have said before one slip one mishap and the politicians would be bombed with the public asking for restrictions and if you don't think they would do just that think again. It has already happened in many places.

By the way I have two boys both raised hunting and fishing. Both raised around animals including wolves. I have never placed them in danger nor have I ever placed them in a situation before I felt they were ready for it. As to the wourst that could happen from a social workers point of veiw. I understand what your saying more then you might expect.

Why Steve did not face charges is he brings in to much revenue and is to popular and thats a shame had any of us done it you know what would have happened.

C M
Great Post points well taken and valid. But we were not under a public microscope where are action can effect others. Those under the camera need to show more caution and care in the actions they do.
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Old 01-05-04, 08:01 PM   #58 (permalink)
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You are telling me that if an accident happens at a LEGAL zoo in another country it will negetively affect private keeping rights in North America?

That doesn't make sense to me personally, no offense to you of course. If it was at Steves home and the baby was killed, o.k. different story. If it was a private keeper letting a child hold hots, again different.

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Old 01-05-04, 09:54 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Great post, Lisa.

Mustangrde1, like you, I dont think that Steve should be above the law, I just dont think that this is something worth arresting somebody for, especially a professional croc wrangler like Steve who basically lives with these animals.

Marisa, I think Mustangrde1 meant that since this story is about privately kept dangerous reptiles, it casts a negative light on keeping reptiles for everybody. And thats a good point. We should keep our hobbies out of the spotlight as much as possible.
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Old 01-06-04, 12:25 AM   #60 (permalink)
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You venomous keepers, what do you think about the question I asked before. In regards to Steve's obvious methods of handling. Do you not think switching his methods so late in his career will affect his performance and skill?
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