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Old 05-13-03, 09:46 PM   #36 (permalink)
KrokadilyanGuy3's Avatar
Join Date: Jan-2003
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but to assume others aren't good keepers because they have UVB bulbs or no sunlight is just silly, and a huge generalization.

..I never said not having natural sunlight was bad. I said keeping animals in a small dark box with flexwatt as heat was just as "inhumane" as feeding live.
Now I also understand that snakes don't require UVation as well, but hey, lets take everything from them...

As well as saying all snakes or herps living in rubbermaids are suffering. Did you even think to consider some that PREFER smaller, less clear housing before making such a broad statement?

Rat snakes, racers, garters, most elapids, most crotalus, ect require more room than most people I've seen give them. Active snakes need more room compared to slow sluggish worms.
But hey, They are only snakes.. And are you sure 16' burms require so little space so many herpers give? If so, forgive me.

I would also like to see your sources for proof that herps/snakes whatever do better in something other than rubbermaid

.. Thrashng from side to side garters or bull snakes from side to side in 4' container looks a tad painful to me.. Hell, even the 200g. troughs appears painful. But hey, as long as noone feeds live. We all love a good bashing.

Not that rubbermaids are the best, but I'd like to see your proof of why they are "cruel" ....maybe for large boids, but not for species such as ball pythons who PREFER to feel safe and secure and stay relatively hidden.

..Given the space, they will use it. I never declined a small box for coziness..

This matches how they behave in the wild.

..They travel and seek shelte in small hides, not live there lives in them.

So why should others force them to endure natural sunlight each day in a huge cage they will be stressed in because you say so?

..Heh. I dont recall saying Give ball pythons sunlight. I said I provide most of my snakes natural sunlight. And a huge cage wont stress them out; Or at least the ones I have raised or care for. ( 6'l.x6'w.x2'h. enclosures for prs.)

Most colubrids are dinural?
..Seasonal on most specimens behaviors.

Are we talking most as in, in the world or most commonly kept?
Throwing all 'dem buggas in a bowl.

Because that would be corns, which prefer early evening and early morning and night time.
I was under the impression the sun was still out during the crespuscular hours.. Before or after the sun sets.. Twilight hours involves the sun showing.. And aren't those lil' creatures active?

Look I agree most snakes could use more room. But I think you are way to generalizing and you aren't telling people how you came to any of these conclusions.

..Well, the post wasn't on housing and never infered to evaluate a scare post on my housing opinions. I only used it to back my statement up on feeding live isn't as evil as everyone sees it out to be. And doing so would make my replies to those a tad longer than this one and I assume most people won't even finish this post unless they are in an arguable mood.

I dont realy understand where are going with all this curalty stuff like you are questioning husbandry skils that were based on nothing but fact and long term studies

Backing a point. Fact, feeding live MAY cause bites. FACT, housing an active creature in a small containment isn't a good deal. Get where I'm going with this?

There is UV bulbs for animals that require natural sun light to live.
Well from past read studies
Most if not all UV bulbs don't even penetrate 6" of air and most enclosures UV is placed well above a foot. Again, past readings, if I'm wrong show me the light. If not, then buying those over priced bulbs are useless..

You know there is probebly ppl reading this thread and saying I sould give my snake natural light too but you faild to mention that you should NEVER under any circomstances expos your cage to natural sun light cause you will have the green house effect meaning the sun light will fillter through the glass of your window and then again through the glass of the enclosure creating somthing like a magnifying glass and roasting your animal
Good point. However, my statements were never to clarify my housing opinions, just back up statements to why do one without expressing another?

who cares what we feed our dogs at least the vets care about them and can patch them up when a stupid keeper screws up.
Ok.. Hmm.. Are you with or against feeding live or dead.. I mean, hurt animals can be fixed too.. I'm lost...

We need to take the initiative to take proper care of our herps it will minimise the vets trips.
So are herps are more important then mans best friend?

What wrong with feeding a ferret to a snake That could hapen it the wild
Ferret to eaten by a Boa wouldn't happen naturally.. But, I never sad it was a problem, just wondering why feed an expensive animal to another. Boredom? Amusement? Lack of the caring ability? Hmm..

ppl feed rabits and guine pigs and latter even pigs so one should not wonder it was probebly the only thing he/she could get there hands on
I dunno, Im sure if you could by a ferret, you could get a mouse; Or at least wait a week for some to arrive. Rabbits as well as pigs are generally cheap. Way cheaper than a ferret mind you. I bet it was because of the above reasons why it was fed.

It may have never hapend to you yet but be warned that it could happen to you tomarow or on any feeding day feeding live is like playing russian roulette when will the bullet be behind the hammer and not a empty chamber.
Good point. Valid point. Damn near the best I've heard so far. And that's the post that would make any live feeder change his mind. All of the previous writtings that tried to show me as a moron have just been defeated. But lifes about chances, things live, things die. God (Yes I'm religious) will decide when it's time for the slithery creature goes.

To Omen's post. I do believe I carried on about snakes eating carrion. However, good post.

And in conclussion, I hope. It doesn't matter how I treat my animals, or how you do yours. (in this post.) My whole starting on this post was because of the thing that feeding dead was the only answer. I'm saying do what you can. Do what works for you. And if you want to convice someone on a topic use various reasonings. Not a picture that was used multiple times. Good day.
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